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Author Topic: 4th qtr failures..  (Read 2700 times)

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twistitup

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4th qtr failures..
« on: June 06, 2019, 01:00:42 pm »

Why are we burning out in the 4th? Is it depth? Nutrition? Desire?

What is it?

How much our nutrition program has been implemented?
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Piggfoot

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2019, 01:10:02 pm »

I think it is an over all lack of talent and depth.
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HogPharmer

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2019, 01:12:48 pm »

Too many halftime PB&J sammiches....
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2019, 01:21:02 pm »

Too many halftime PB&J sammiches....

we don't know WHAT they are eating at halftime...we need to find out, 'reporters' need to do their jobs.
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Karma

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2019, 01:23:05 pm »

Last year the problem was we were usually down about 3 TD's entering the 4th quarter.
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ricepig

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2019, 02:32:15 pm »

Delph.....not enough Marvin Delph in the 4th qt.
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Sed76

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2019, 03:07:50 pm »

I think a lot of it is mental. This team has lost so many games at the end the past few years it has to weigh on them. Seriously, last year against Ole Miss was there anyone either watching at home or sitting in the pouring rain who thought they would not march right down the field and score at the end? If the fans knew it was coming you know the players know it as well. We need to win one of these games against a SEC opponent and kill off these demons.
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phadedhawg

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2019, 03:12:50 pm »

While talent is the obvious flaw on last year's team, there was a lot of "here we go again" when bad things happened to blunt momentum during the 2nd half of games.
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King Kong

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2019, 03:25:48 pm »

Mental toughness and of understanding how to win
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2019, 03:32:14 pm »

While talent is the obvious flaw on last year's team, there was a lot of "here we go again" when bad things happened to blunt momentum during the 2nd half of games.

Will that be the same attitude this season? Bad things will happen.

If we had the 4th figured out, we would have had a couple more wins last season. I don't know if it's all mental or not, but I don't hold up the 4 any longer...I guess my confidence level is low just like the team. As a fan, I want to get back to the point where I hold up 4 fingers with confidence when going into the final quarter of battle.

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LZH

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2019, 03:37:10 pm »

Football games are 1.5 quarters too long for our Hogs.
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ricepig

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2019, 03:55:36 pm »

Will that be the same attitude this season? Bad things will happen.

If we had the 4th figured out, we would have had a couple more wins last season. I don't know if it's all mental or not, but I don't hold up the 4 any longer...I guess my confidence level is low just like the team. As a fan, I want to get back to the point where I hold up 4 fingers with confidence when going into the final quarter of battle.



You’ll be holding up 4 right before the end of the 3rd qt this year, “yeah, I’ll take 4 more.”
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2019, 04:03:01 pm »

You’ll be holding up 4 right before the end of the 3rd qt this year, “yeah, I’ll take 4 more.”

...I hope they get the tap lines figured out. They voted for alcohol sales just in time to run more lines below the new
surface.


But, tap lines don't solve our 'on field' 4th qtr problems.
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ricepig

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2019, 04:22:13 pm »

...I hope they get the tap lines figured out. They voted for alcohol sales just in time to run more lines below the new
surface.


But, tap lines don't solve our 'on field' 4th qtr problems.

Maybe they plan to “tap” into them?
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SooieGeneris

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2019, 08:20:11 pm »

I think a lot of it is mental. This team has lost so many games at the end the past few years it has to weigh on them. Seriously, last year against Ole Miss was there anyone either watching at home or sitting in the pouring rain who thought they would not march right down the field and score at the end? If the fans knew it was coming you know the players know it as well. We need to win one of these games against a SEC opponent and kill off these demons.

Brandon Allen had that problem most of his career but overcame all that history the 2nd half of his SR year with some remarkable comebacks. I still say Bert shouldn't have taken the ball out of his hands at the end of the MSU game and played for a FG.

Yes, that is the conventional move, but we did not have a clutch kicking game to count on.

This program will gain a lot of confidence when/if we ever come out on top in one of those vs an SEC opponent.

Yes, some of it is not enough depth but I don't believe either OM or CSU had more depth than us in 2018. Bert let the team slack off in conditioning for most if not all of his time here and we haven't recovered yet.
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2019, 08:57:35 pm »

Bert let the team slack off in conditioning for most if not all of his time here and we haven't recovered yet.

Sorry, but it shouldn't take THAT long to recover from conditioning issues. That cannot be an excuse going into fall.
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nwahogfan1

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2019, 09:05:05 pm »

Why are we burning out in the 4th? Is it depth? Nutrition? Desire?

What is it?

How much our nutrition program has been implemented?

I think its lack of subbing and they get worn down. .
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Porkys Revenge

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #17 on: June 06, 2019, 09:05:27 pm »

Sorry, but it shouldn't take THAT long to recover from conditioning issues. That cannot be an excuse going into fall.
it was mental and a total backlash last year. Those guys weren’t used to being pushed like that and it showed, there was a mutiny.

Remember when Petrino got canned and all the players were gushing about how smooth things were going and how much they loved johnnelle running around slapping them on the ass and asking them if their piss was hot.

After I read about that I was like, lord help us.
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havok

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2019, 07:04:12 am »

I can't recall when we Didn't have to play our starting Linebackers around 90+% of the game.  Quality Depth at that position has been a unfixed issue for multiple seasons.

The Inability to get team's offense off the field, compounds this problem when our defenders are on the field for such long stretches.

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Superhog1959

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2019, 07:14:30 am »

I think depth and fatigue is part of it. But also the inability to make in game coaching adjustments is a factor too. Esp. in the 2nd half.
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2019, 07:16:29 am »

I think depth and fatigue is part of it. But also the inability to make in game coaching adjustments is a factor too. Esp. in the 2nd half.

You may be right.... we will see this season if this staff has the ability to make in game adjustments. We have seen other teams makes adjustments against us, I hope we can start doing the same
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Pork Twain

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2019, 07:42:22 am »

I saw this post title and thought, I am going to click on it and make a smartassed comment about it really being about food, but it really was about food.  You win TIU...you win
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sowmonella

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #22 on: June 07, 2019, 08:58:03 am »

Depth. It was pretty obvious.
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OkieBack

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #23 on: June 07, 2019, 01:14:45 pm »

While talent is the obvious flaw on last year's team, there was a lot of "here we go again" when bad things happened to blunt momentum during the 2nd half of games.

This and the fact our Defense just spent way too much time on the field.  If our offense can sustain drives and our Defense can have a little more luck holding em on 3rd down then that will help with the time-on-the-field factor.

Having numbers and upping our talent level on both sides of the ball should do wonders in the long run.  I just don't think we've seen the monster yet that Chief can build.  Let's see how Chavis builds this Defense with the next couple years of recruits and I think we will start owning the 4th quarter.  Especially as our offense gains confidence and can score more points.
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Superhog1959

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #24 on: June 07, 2019, 04:30:26 pm »

This and the fact our Defense just spent way too much time on the field.  If our offense can sustain drives and our Defense can have a little more luck holding em on 3rd down then that will help with the time-on-the-field factor.

Having numbers and upping our talent level on both sides of the ball should do wonders in the long run.  I just don't think we've seen the monster yet that Chief can build.  Let's see how Chavis builds this Defense with the next couple years of recruits and I think we will start owning the 4th quarter.  Especially as our offense gains confidence and can score more points.
Agreed, to much time on the field. Also short field. Get better on ST and it will help offense and defense.
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Pudgepork

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2019, 08:36:17 pm »

All the hogs need is a 35 pt lead going into the 4th. 

They let ole miss escape defeat last season.  Have let aTm escape defeat several times over the last 8 yrs.   Just need a huge lead going into the 4th and their confidence will soar.  Hopefully really good to have so many new players who havent experienced the here we go again endings
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HogBreath

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #26 on: June 08, 2019, 06:30:26 am »

Part of it is mental, and part of it is just in y'all's heads.
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HogBreath

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #27 on: June 08, 2019, 06:32:57 am »


 We need to win one of these games against a SEC opponent and kill off these demons.
 

So more exorcising ya think?
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sigpooie

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #28 on: June 08, 2019, 06:37:43 am »

It was the clown car dept. Athletic conditioning  dept. I think their all gone. I hope...
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HogBreath

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #29 on: June 08, 2019, 07:07:45 am »

It was the clown car dept. Athletic conditioning  dept. I think their all gone. I hope...

They are.
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havok

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #30 on: June 08, 2019, 07:32:06 am »

This and the fact our Defense just spent way too much time on the field. 

One has to think the Defensive players (Especially the positions like Linebacker where they had to play starters almost every down) needed so much more recovery time to treat bumps, bruises and other nagging issues...that by end of year, they pretty much could only get back to about 80% before the next game.
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King Kong

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #31 on: June 08, 2019, 07:33:24 am »

All the hogs need is a 35 pt lead going into the 4th. 


Agreed. Hogs are undefeated with 35 point 4 quarter leads.

I can’t believe CCM hasn’t thought of this yet
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LRRandy

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #32 on: June 08, 2019, 01:54:52 pm »

It was the clown car dept. Athletic conditioning  dept. I think their all gone. I hope...
does that mean the freaks won't be coming out at night?
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Superhog1959

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #33 on: June 10, 2019, 07:00:07 am »

does that mean the freaks won't be coming out at night?
I would rather they came out at night, than at 11am.
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lasthog

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #34 on: June 16, 2019, 09:41:07 pm »

Why are we burning out in the 4th? Is it depth? Nutrition? Desire?

What is it?

How much our nutrition program has been implemented?

I don't know about the rest of y'all, but I'm just getting old. Don't know about the team though.
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Tejano Jawg

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #35 on: June 17, 2019, 12:10:39 am »

Mental? Physical fatigue? (Because of conditioning and/or lack of depth to keep starters fresher)? Can be anything, or any small thing. There have been games in the past few years where 1 or 2 plays could've changed everything. Make the 3rd down stop, and prevent the drive from continuing all the way to the endzone. Or make the block that keeps our drive alive. It's been awhile since we've been capable of spectacular plays, so I'm not considering those. I'm talking about a few routine plays that weren't made.

Last year—as OkieBack pointed out above—and it had to be one of the things that doomed us most. Our D was better last year, and maybe good enough to have kept us in games IF the offense had done their part. However, our defense was not SO great that it could last that long on the field. And it showed up in the 4th. Maybe it was just a couple more first downs by our offense to keep them on the sideline. Or a few less turnovers. Kelley and Storey combined for 15 interceptions last year. How much time did all those cost the defense?

There's one more thing that's outside of these, one more intangible. It's the mystical thing of "knowing how to win...knowing how to finish." I think this, while it's made up of the mental and physical, exists on another level. Some teams have it. And we have to get it. Go back to the 2014 season and the Texas A&M game. We had that game, and almost had A&M buried, but a few things started happening late. I remember well what Gary Danielson said as the Ags were starting to come back..."in the SEC, you have to finish." It's like he could sense something. That game was a long time ago, but I used to think that one game set some really bad mojo in motion.
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Hawgphat

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #36 on: June 17, 2019, 12:18:54 am »

As of right now, we have no 2019 4th quarter failures.  There may prove to be some, - - - but I'm not minded to concede that likely eventuality by throwing in the towel before the season even arrives.  I don't expect this coming season to be anything like last season in terms of miscues, inconsistencies and glaring deficiencies on either side of the ball.

I'm not predicting Top 20; - - I'm simply expecting "much better".
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #37 on: June 17, 2019, 05:43:06 am »

I don't expect this coming season to be anything like last season in terms of miscues, inconsistencies and glaring deficiencies on either side of the ball.



I hope you are correct. My major worries are oline and qb -
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Hogmatic

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #38 on: June 17, 2019, 07:25:34 am »

As of right now, we have no 2019 4th quarter failures.  There may prove to be some, - - - but I'm not minded to concede that likely eventuality by throwing in the towel before the season even arrives.  I don't expect this coming season to be anything like last season in terms of miscues, inconsistencies and glaring deficiencies on either side of the ball.

I'm not predicting Top 20; - - I'm simply expecting "much better".

I think we will have depth issues at LB that will show up in the second half.   Otherwise, the new WRs and Hicks could make a major impact if the Oline is better (doesn't have to be great if the WRs get open quick).   The better offense will make the defense better by keeping them off the field and reducing the impact of the LB depth.
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liljo

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #39 on: June 17, 2019, 01:58:55 pm »

Part of it is mental, and part of it is just in y'all's heads.
Agreed. I still can't get the Skipper Trip call against A&M out of my head, and that's been years...Just seems typical for the Razorbacks. If everything looks to be going well, if we have a lead, we just start praying the clock will run faster.

I could literally "feel" the tension rise when Arkansas punted the ball back to Ole Miss last year in LR, very late in the game. We had a small lead, and there was only about a minute left. It was a great punt, well covered...I could hear the mumbles of people all around me, "well, they are about to lose again." And lose we did.

Personally, I think we've been a cursed program since Ken Hatfield left. But I keep on hopin' for the best. I do love this coaching staff, and think they have the integrity, desire, and skillset to get Arkansas football back to its highest level--which isn't all that high over the past three decades. I know, a bunch will say, "it was high under Petrino" as if they were just going to get better and better as long as Bobby was here. History proves otherwise. Had Bobby continued to win here, he most likely would have been swept away by another major school. Same with Brett Bielema. IF he had won big here, it would have most likely been a stepping stone to another big school, somewhere in the Midwest.

The SECw absolute was NOT on the level it is now during Nutt's years here, top to bottom. I think he took the program just about as far as it can ever hope to consistently go in this conference, despite what people think of him personally. He won enough to keep the job, bringing some stability to the team.

Fans like myself begin to doubt whether we'll even live long enough to ever see another truly great Razorback football team. It's a very difficult job, all factors considered. Alabama is always great. LSU is always ultra-talented and capable of making a run. Auburn is usually talented and tough. A&M has all the re$ource$ needed to compete at a very high level. Somebody has to be these teams punching bag, and for years it's been Arkansas and the Mississippi schools which consistently take the brunt of the punching.

In short, we've become a program that "hopes" to win, but "expects" to lose. Let any negative thing happen in a close game down the stretch and we just cave in. You can feel it in the stands. I'm pretty sure the players feel it, too.
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EarlCampbellsHotLink

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #40 on: June 17, 2019, 02:01:30 pm »

Players meal should be Frito Chili Pie...damn them!
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Jonbo

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #41 on: June 18, 2019, 06:13:11 pm »

At least 50% of it is 90% mental. Of the rest, 1/4, at least, is half physical. Most of what's left is psychological. The rest is coaching. JMO.
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bennyl08

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #42 on: June 18, 2019, 06:40:02 pm »

I think we will have depth issues at LB that will show up in the second half.   Otherwise, the new WRs and Hicks could make a major impact if the Oline is better (doesn't have to be great if the WRs get open quick).   The better offense will make the defense better by keeping them off the field and reducing the impact of the LB depth.

LB is one of the only positions we shouldn't be worried about depth. Harris, Pool, and McClure are our three starting LB'ers. That's a real good starting trio. McClure will likely be backed up by a CB rather than a LB. Morgan is good enough to start for several SEC teams and is a backup for us, and Henry is probably on par with several of our previous starters. Deon Edwards just recently moved from S so who knows if he ends up having a Anthony Leon like transformation and LaFrance had a lot of potential coming out of HS and again, could be just a Spaight/Eugene like lightswitch from relatively obscure backup to key player. In terms of youth, Parker hits hard and has some good speed. He was very, very raw as a player but has had a year to redshirt.

That gives us 3 starters as good as we have had in a long, long time. One excellent backup and another who is solid. We don't start running into question marks and maybe's until you hit the third string, and you'll find that on any team's roster.
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #43 on: June 18, 2019, 07:56:32 pm »

Players meal should be Frito Chili Pie...damn them!

no beans in the chili
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Porked Tongue

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #44 on: June 18, 2019, 07:58:10 pm »

Why are we burning out in the 4th? Is it depth? Nutrition? Desire?

What is it?

How much our nutrition program has been implemented?
Pepsi
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twistitup

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #45 on: June 18, 2019, 08:01:44 pm »

Pepsi


It did start happening around the signing of that [CENSORED] contract.

The Pepsi Curse continues...Pepsi has been cursed ever since that MJ commercial in the late 80's
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Superhog1959

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #46 on: June 22, 2019, 08:38:08 am »

At least 50% of it is 90% mental. Of the rest, 1/4, at least, is half physical. Most of what's left is psychological. The rest is coaching. JMO.
WOW that's really deep man. Are you a doctor? lol I read this 5 times, still not sure I get it.
Some of my thoughts.
When you lack in quality depth. Other coaches pay attention. There will be set plays based on positions of who is in and who is out on that play. Predetermined play called based on who the sub is. Offense and defense.
If your the coach and know this you tend not to sub so and so unless you have no choice.

That leads us to fatigue. You get tired you slow down. Lose your stamina. But sill might be better than your backup.

That leads us to injuries. Playing tired, can lead to developing bad habits, or loss of proper fundamentals. And fatigue can also lead to injuries. Which weakens or can even destroy a team.

Its a domino effect. Lack of quality depth, is the root cause. Addressing this issue is the first step to improvement.
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Hogmatic

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #47 on: June 22, 2019, 10:12:26 am »

LB is one of the only positions we shouldn't be worried about depth. Harris, Pool, and McClure are our three starting LB'ers. That's a real good starting trio. McClure will likely be backed up by a CB rather than a LB. Morgan is good enough to start for several SEC teams and is a backup for us, and Henry is probably on par with several of our previous starters. Deon Edwards just recently moved from S so who knows if he ends up having a Anthony Leon like transformation and LaFrance had a lot of potential coming out of HS and again, could be just a Spaight/Eugene like lightswitch from relatively obscure backup to key player. In terms of youth, Parker hits hard and has some good speed. He was very, very raw as a player but has had a year to redshirt.

That gives us 3 starters as good as we have had in a long, long time. One excellent backup and another who is solid. We don't start running into question marks and maybe's until you hit the third string, and you'll find that on any team's roster.

You make good points but the HUNH spread offenses have changed the need for depth.    Our LB starters have been burning out in the mid 3rd quarter for 3+ years.   Our LB's do well in the first half but the coverage requirements create more fatigue than run support.  Much of the problem stemmed from our CBB Def practicing against a slow play action I formation offense as well as players from that style tried to simulate the HUNH Spread on the scout team.  We would see good HUNH Spread offenses in real life games which led to getting gassed in games. 
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robs4516

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #48 on: June 22, 2019, 10:45:50 am »

Players meal should be Frito Chili Pie...damn them!

With jalapenos. Gotta get that piss hot!
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PorkSoda

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Re: 4th qtr failures..
« Reply #49 on: August 09, 2019, 03:31:02 pm »

Football games are 1.5 quarters too long for our Hogs.
^^^Truth
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