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A little third party 2019 insight from CFN

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Gonzo:

https://collegefootballnews.com/2019/03/19-for-19-offseason-topics-no-17-every-power-five-teams-letdown-game

I found this piece, coupled with another where their O/U win total for the Hogs is 6, to be very interesting. For the Hogs they name the WKU game, not really surprising imo, often the SEC teams' late non-conference matchups fall in that category.

What caught my attention was that the Hogs were either directly named as another SEC opponent's letdown/sandwich game (UK, Bama, and LSU) or mentioned as a more dangerous possible letup game for for Auburn or A&M over the non-conference rent-a-win thet named.


Granted, on the negative side it's not a good thing to be considered the surprise trap game for another team, but for a team looking for an identity and a boost I think it could be a big positive that the conference scheduling for the Hogs opponents might help out a bit.


Anyway, food for thought, and (probably) arguments ;)



Go Hogs!


247Hog:

I would be ecstatic if we win 6 games and competitive in our loses.

The Kig:


--- Quote from: 247Hog on March 11, 2019, 11:06:41 am ---I would be ecstatic if we win 6 games and competitive in our loses.

--- End quote ---

Pretty much what he said... although there's a really big jug of koolaid calling my name that just makes me OK with 6 vs ecstatic.

Starting to think we can come together and win 6+...

go hogues:


--- Quote from: The Kig on March 11, 2019, 11:35:41 am ---Starting to think we can come together and win 6+...

--- End quote ---
And so it begins.

SSFrazorback:

In before someone says ď8 wins.Ē

The_Iceman:


--- Quote from: 247Hog on March 11, 2019, 11:06:41 am ---I would be ecstatic if we win 6 games and competitive in our loses.

--- End quote ---

Offer that to me now, and I take it and look forward to the bowl game.

HogJowler:


--- Quote from: SSFrazorback on March 11, 2019, 12:06:24 pm ---In before someone says ď8 wins.Ē

--- End quote ---

If we win 8 games I will buy season tickets.

mckinneyhog5:

If we win less then 6, we hired the wrong coach.

Hog Fan...DOH!:

Drink it now, die happy

The Kig:


--- Quote from: go hogues on March 11, 2019, 11:39:04 am ---And so it begins.

--- End quote ---

Meh... not going off the deep end.  Been there too many times in the past and still skeptical about the staff.  Just can't ever find a way to be ecstatic over 6 wins.  Big difference. 

247Hog:


--- Quote from: The Kig on March 11, 2019, 01:06:32 pm ---Meh... not going off the deep end.  Been there too many times in the past and still skeptical about the staff.  Just can't ever find a way to be ecstatic over 6 wins.  Big difference.

--- End quote ---

Did you watch us last season? If so, then yes you should be ecstatic for 6 wins NEXT YEAR. Not ecstatic every year to win 6 but with the way we looked last season, 6 wins would be huge. Bowl game and major improvement to sell to recruits.

After the Missouri game, i thought we would be sunk even more by losing recruits but we actually improved IMO. I'm realistic and know we're not winning any championship next year so making it to a bowl game sets us up well for 2020.

hobhog:

6 wins should keep recruiting momentum. Iíll be dissatisfied with less, shocked if more.

Bacons Rebellion:

4 wins plus 8 chances for an upset.

Darren DeLoach (semohawg):


--- Quote from: mckinneyhog5 on March 11, 2019, 12:41:35 pm ---If we win less then 6, we hired the wrong coach.

--- End quote ---

We will win 5 and he is the right guy. So there...

SRV:


--- Quote from: 247Hog on March 11, 2019, 03:23:23 pm ---Did you watch us last season? If so, then yes you should be ecstatic for 6 wins NEXT YEAR. Not ecstatic every year to win 6 but with the way we looked last season, 6 wins would be huge. Bowl game and major improvement to sell to recruits.

After the Missouri game, i thought we would be sunk even more by losing recruits but we actually improved IMO. I'm realistic and know we're not winning any championship next year so making it to a bowl game sets us up well for 2020.

--- End quote ---
Put me down for thrilled with 6 wins, for next year. Speaking of Missouri, I'd love for that to be one of the 6. I'm already way past tired of them.

mckinneyhog5:


--- Quote from: Darren DeLoach (semohawg) on March 11, 2019, 09:52:22 pm ---We will win 5 and he is the right guy. So there...

--- End quote ---
If the guy is what some people claim he his, we'll win 6+. If he isn't, then we'll be looking for another coach in 2-3 years. I don't get the low expectations for a coach some claim is the best offensive mind in CF and directly responsible for Clemson's success. 

The Hawgman:


--- Quote from: 247Hog on March 11, 2019, 11:06:41 am ---I would be ecstatic if we win 6 games and competitive in our loses.

--- End quote ---
I am not a big Morris apologist but we will win at least 6


Al Boarland:


--- Quote from: mckinneyhog5 on March 12, 2019, 12:06:45 am ---I don't get the low expectations for a coach some claim is the best offensive mind in CF and directly responsible for Clemson's success.

--- End quote ---

Because he set the bar so low last season. Fans get to blame the roster and previous staff. It's the perfect mix for the start of 2019.

Al Boarland:


--- Quote from: The Hawgman on March 12, 2019, 12:14:05 am ---I am not a big Morris apologist but we will win at least 6

--- End quote ---

Most teams sleepwalk to 6 wins. It's very doable.

LZH:


--- Quote from: mckinneyhog5 on March 12, 2019, 12:06:45 am ---I don't get the low expectations for a coach some claim is the best offensive mind in CF and directly responsible for Clemson's success. 

--- End quote ---

We are so gunshy because fat boy was even better than Nutt was about convincing everyone (including his own boss, coaches, and players...not to mention us gullible saps) that if a season is shot by mid-October, "we're only a year away....", or "we are soooo close".

We have people around here who don't wanna admit that anything less than a bowl game appearance in 2019 would be a disappointment - they can't allow themselves to think it....much less say it.

And you're right Al, he did set a pretty low bar last year....and I don't think it's all on the roster and the previous staff.  He made some poor calls/choices that cost us at times.  However, I like to believe he realizes it, is aware of where the problems were, and will not make the same mistakes over and over.  Taking a chance on a long pass play, an onside kick, or going for it on 4th and 5 at midfield are not really what I mean.  Leaving a QB on the field to throw a season's worth of INT's, and possible shattering any confidence he had built up, is what I mean....a QB who had not separated himself as the clear #1 guy.

MuskogeeHogFan:


--- Quote from: Al Boarland on March 12, 2019, 03:57:08 am ---Most teams sleepwalk to 6 wins. It's very doable.

--- End quote ---

It's true that about 62.5% of all P-5 teams won at least 6 games LY, but "sleepwalked" their way to 6 wins? Oh Al.

Formula Hog:

You guys that wanted change so bad....you got it. But since the guy was hired, and so much distain for CBB, he's basically been declared the savior of Razorback Football. And he's not delivered anything as a coach. Don't bring up the recruiting. He's made a bunch of bonehead decisions.

If they get 6 wins it will be a great step in the right direction. But I am still not convinced he's worthy of all the hype.

All you CCM apologists better hope he improves. Or he's gonna be gone.

Bacons Rebellion:


--- Quote from: Al Boarland on March 12, 2019, 03:57:08 am ---Most teams sleepwalk to 6 wins. It's very doable.

--- End quote ---

And we've been right there to help them.

6 wins are doable. I believe we'll be a lot better this year, but I think we've dug ourselves such a deep hole that we can be much better and it not show up in the win column. I think the wins start coming more frequently in 2020.

We have no position we can point to as a strength right now except maybe the defensive line and maybe tight end. The secondary is basically sophomores. Thin at running back. We're dependent on freshman at wide receiver. The offensive line is hopes and wishes, waiting for emergency help to arrive this summer.

Being that dependent on new guys means we will still not have the depth to win in the 4th quarter in the SEC, or be good on kick coverage, or to overcome inevitable injuries.

We have way too many ways to lose games and not enough ways to win them.

Maybe Hicks will be a master of the offense. Maybe our young wide receivers will be all we hope for. Maybe Boyd / Whaley / Haydn prove to be a great 1-2-3 punch. Maybe our O-line comes together. Maybe our young secondary can defeat SEC wide receivers. Maybe our senior defensive line can dominate SEC offensive lines and disrupt offenses, allowing secondary to gel. Maybe no one gets injured. Maybe an opponent implodes -- there' usually one of those a year in the SEC.

Some of those maybes will probably come true, but there are just too many maybes to be confident of anything.

MuskogeeHogFan:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 06:46:09 am ---You guys that wanted change so bad....you got it. But since the guy was hired, and so much distain for CBB, he's basically been declared the savior of Razorback Football. And he's not delivered anything as a coach. Don't bring up the recruiting. He's made a bunch of bonehead decisions.

If they get 6 wins it will be a great step in the right direction. But I am still not convinced he's worthy of all the hype.

All you CCM apologists better hope he improves. Or he's gonna be gone.

--- End quote ---

Wow! Never heard that out of you before. ;)

RyanMallettsEgo:


--- Quote from: mckinneyhog5 on March 12, 2019, 12:06:45 am ---If the guy is what some people claim he his, we'll win 6+. If he isn't, then we'll be looking for another coach in 2-3 years. I don't get the low expectations for a coach some claim is the best offensive mind in CF and directly responsible for Clemson's success.

--- End quote ---

Well, hard to argue with logic this sound.

RyanMallettsEgo:


--- Quote from: Al Boarland on March 12, 2019, 03:55:58 am ---Because he set the bar so low last season. Fans get to blame the roster and previous staff. It's the perfect mix for the start of 2019.

--- End quote ---

Have you not seen the turnover from last year to this year? Do you not think thereís a reason for that? Or itís just for the hell of it, I guess.

And when the previous staff goes 4-8 in year five, I think that says just a little bit.

RyanMallettsEgo:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 06:46:09 am ---You guys that wanted change so bad....you got it. But since the guy was hired, and so much distain for CBB, he's basically been declared the savior of Razorback Football. And he's not delivered anything as a coach. Don't bring up the recruiting. He's made a bunch of bonehead decisions.

If they get 6 wins it will be a great step in the right direction. But I am still not convinced he's worthy of all the hype.

All you CCM apologists better hope he improves. Or he's gonna be gone.

--- End quote ---

Imagine being a Bielema apologist at this stage.

HogX:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 06:46:09 am ---All you CCM apologists better hope he improves. Or he's gonna be gone.

--- End quote ---

I would think that anyone that considers themselves a Razorback fan would hope he improves.  But whatever your priorities are, I suppose.

RyanMallettsEgo:


--- Quote from: HogX on March 12, 2019, 09:13:59 am ---I would think that anyone that considers themselves a Razorback fan would hope he improves.  But whatever your priorities are, I suppose.

--- End quote ---

That's what's funny about guys like him. He's so pissy and moody about not getting the guy he wanted, he'd rather see the program fail completely.

Poor baby.

ricepig:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 06:46:09 am ---You guys that wanted change so bad....you got it. But since the guy was hired, and so much distain for CBB, he's basically been declared the savior of Razorback Football. And he's not delivered anything as a coach. Don't bring up the recruiting. He's made a bunch of bonehead decisions.

If they get 6 wins it will be a great step in the right direction. But I am still not convinced he's worthy of all the hype.

All you CCM apologists better hope he improves. Or he's gonna be gone.

--- End quote ---

Oh, itís pretty obvious that if he doesnít improve, heíll be gone. It will be in about 4 more years to get the clear picture on this improvement, or lack there of. I never understood how fans wanted a coach fired after one or two years.

HawgFan4lyfe:


--- Quote from: HogJowler on March 11, 2019, 12:28:30 pm ---If we win 8 games I will buy season tickets.

--- End quote ---
After a 2-10 season to win 8 I will definitely get my season tickets back.

Formula Hog:

Again,
   I do not want to see the team fail. I am tired of losing and getting embarrassed since CBP went into that ditch. I just think we hired the wrong coach, with the wrong staff, in the wrong league, with the wrong experience and record.

Julie Peoples let JJ and Terry Don talk her into blowing our entire program up. By doing that they forced a losing coach on us from inferior backgrounds and experience bring our program to new depths and lows.

I want to be able to say I was so wrong about this guy. But seeing other coaches around the SEC and the other P5 leagues, he's not the guy in my book. Again, just because he can recruit, DOES NOT mean he can coach. 2-10 is 2-10.





ricepig:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 09:45:38 am ---Again,
   I do not want to see the team fail. I am tired of losing and getting embarrassed since CBP went into that ditch. I just think we hired the wrong coach, with the wrong staff, in the wrong league, with the wrong experience and record.

Julie Peoples let JJ and Terry Don talk her into blowing our entire program up. By doing that they forced a losing coach on us from inferior backgrounds and experience bring our program to new depths and lows.

I want to be able to say I was so wrong about this guy. But seeing other coaches around the SEC and the other P5 leagues, he's not the guy in my book. Again, just because he can recruit, DOES NOT mean he can coach. 2-10 is 2-10.





--- End quote ---
Yeah, Iím sure Jerry and Terry Don donít want the best for the Razorbacks, itís not like they have any connection here. Itís way too early to decide he canít get it done, sure he made a few poor decisions on the sidelines, but so does every other head coach. He deserves the opportunity to get his players in his system, if we win 3-5 games in 2020, Iíll be beside you with the pitchforks.

oldhawg:


--- Quote from: ricepig on March 12, 2019, 09:55:17 am ---Yeah, Iím sure Jerry and Terry Don donít want the best for the Razorbacks, itís not like they have any connection here. Itís way too early to decide he canít get it done, sure he made a few poor decisions on the sidelines, but so does every other head coach. He deserves the opportunity to get his players in his system, if we win 3-5 games in 2020, Iíll be beside you with the pitchforks.

--- End quote ---

Guess I missed something along the way.  Did Terry Don Phillips have a hand in Morris's hiring?  A strong recommendation from Clemson's former AD?  "Insider" influence?  I was of the opinion that Jerry Jones was the primary (perhaps only) not so much behind the scenes proponent of hiring Morris.

UnknownNobody:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 09:45:38 am ---Again,
   I do not want to see the team fail. I am tired of losing and getting embarrassed since CBP went into that ditch. I just think we hired the wrong coach, with the wrong staff, in the wrong league, with the wrong experience and record.

Julie Peoples let JJ and Terry Don talk her into blowing our entire program up. By doing that they forced a losing coach on us from inferior backgrounds and experience bring our program to new depths and lows.

I want to be able to say I was so wrong about this guy. But seeing other coaches around the SEC and the other P5 leagues, he's not the guy in my book. Again, just because he can recruit, DOES NOT mean he can coach. 2-10 is 2-10.

--- End quote ---

I am here to straight up call you a liar. You want Morris to fail so you can say you were right. Nearly every post you have had since Oct basically runs on the same theme. "Morris sucks, his staff sucks, we hired a loser with a losing record." 

We get it you don't like Morris and make up theories to support your beliefs. Whatever.

If Morris fails as you hope and pray he will it will be the end of Arkansas football. We will be relegated to hiring "up and comers" who if they succeed at the UA will move on to a "better" program.

If things go as you want them to we will become the Kentucky of the West without the championship basketball program to hang our hat on.

UnknownNobody:


--- Quote from: oldhawg on March 12, 2019, 10:03:19 am ---Guess I missed something along the way.  Did Terry Don Phillips have a hand in Morris's hiring?  A strong recommendation from Clemson's former AD?  "Insider" influence?  I was of the opinion that Jerry Jones was the primary (perhaps only) not so much behind the scenes proponent of hiring Morris.

--- End quote ---

Terry Don called Julie Cormer Peoples and put in a good word for Morris. Morris was given an interview after they had looked at other candidates and found them lacking. Morris came in prepared and blew the committee away.

It was a committee decision not JCP's decision. Jerry Jones was not on the committee. Terry Don Phillips was not on the committee.

RyanMallettsEgo:


--- Quote from: UnknownNobody on March 12, 2019, 10:13:04 am ---I am here to straight up call you a liar. You want Morris to fail so you can say you were right. Nearly every post you have had since Oct basically runs on the same theme. "Morris sucks, his staff sucks, we hired a loser with a losing record." 

We get it you don't like Morris and make up theories to support your beliefs. Whatever.

If Morris fails as you hope and pray he will it will be the end of Arkansas football. We will be relegated to hiring "up and comers" who if they succeed at the UA will move on to a "better" program.

If things go as you want them to we will become the Kentucky of the West without the championship basketball program to hang our hat on.

--- End quote ---

Hey, if Morris fails then Formula will get to come beat his chest on an anonymous message board and tell us all he was right.

If that's not cool, I dunno what is!

UnknownNobody:


--- Quote from: RyanMallettsEgo on March 12, 2019, 10:36:44 am ---Hey, if Morris fails then Formula will get to come beat his chest on an anonymous message board and tell us all he was right.

If that's not cool, I dunno what is!

--- End quote ---

What is hillarious and annoyingly sad at the same time is Formula drives the first year record of 2-10 into the ground in nearly every post. He will then chide others on the board for wanting to get rid of Bert.

Bert was 3-9 his first year and was given 5yrs. His last team won 4 games on the heels of the 2016 end of season meltdown.

HogPharmer:


--- Quote from: Al Boarland on March 12, 2019, 03:57:08 am ---Most teams sleepwalk to 6 wins. It's very doable.

--- End quote ---

Most teams aren't in the SEC West

Mo_Better_Hogs:

If the 6 wins included Texas A&M, I'd sign right now.

Hogmatic:


--- Quote from: UnknownNobody on March 12, 2019, 10:36:15 am ---Terry Don called Julie Cormer Peoples and put in a good word for Morris. Morris was given an interview after they had looked at other candidates and found them lacking. Morris came in prepared and blew the committee away.

It was a committee decision not JCP's decision. Jerry Jones was not on the committee. Terry Don Phillips was not on the committee.

--- End quote ---

Thanks for clearing up the distorted crap some are stirring.

Grizzlyfan:


--- Quote from: Hogmatic on March 12, 2019, 11:56:44 am ---Thanks for clearing up the distorted crap some are stirring.

--- End quote ---
There may very well have been some distortions.  But don't pretend for a second that Jerry Jones had no influence on this hire simply because he wasn't on the committee.

Formula Hog:

Of course he wowed them. He's a con and a used car salesman. That's what makes him a good recruiter.

And JJ DID make the call to JCP. How do you think he got the interview?

Either way, we've never had a worse record from a coach's first season than this clown.

I'd like to know what you guys see that I don't? He's got High School connections. Great! What's that done for him on the sideline in college?

They are all over their heads. Especially on offense. I gave Chavis a pass because he's been around. But he better have the D a lot better this season. You guys want a winner so bad that you'll crown a loser because you wanted CBB gone!

I mean almost all of you were so sure of this guy last season and he bombed! Terribly!

What makes you think he's any different of a coach than last season? Stop blaming it on the players. When CBB was there we had no problem on offense. How many points did we score last year?

6 wins? Please. we will be lucky with 3-4-5. And even if that happens the apologists will be here saying he's great.

Hogmatic:


--- Quote from: Grizzlyfan on March 12, 2019, 12:05:14 pm ---There may very well have been some distortions.  But don't pretend for a second that Jerry Jones had no influence on this hire simply because he wasn't on the committee.

--- End quote ---

We got a good coach in Morris.  The school has set a precedent that we will give Mediocre Mike 8 years so that means CCM should get at least 8 years too.

RyanMallettsEgo:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 12:12:51 pm ---Of course he wowed them. He's a con and a used car salesman. That's what makes him a good recruiter.

And JJ DID make the call to JCP. How do you think he got the interview?

Either way, we've never had a worse record from a coach's first season than this clown.

I'd like to know what you guys see that I don't? He's got High School connections. Great! What's that done for him on the sideline in college?

They are all over their heads. Especially on offense. I gave Chavis a pass because he's been around. But he better have the D a lot better this season. You guys want a winner so bad that you'll crown a loser because you wanted CBB gone!

I mean almost all of you were so sure of this guy last season and he bombed! Terribly!

What makes you think he's any different of a coach than last season? Stop blaming it on the players. When CBB was there we had no problem on offense. How many points did we score last year?

6 wins? Please. we will be lucky with 3-4-5. And even if that happens the apologists will be here saying he's great.

--- End quote ---

I don't think many were "sure" of Morris coming in year one. If they were, that's their fault.

Hey, Jen, don't look now but Bret's record here was 29-34. In five years. And he went 4-8. In year five.  That's, uh, that's a losing recored. Ergo, Bret's a loser.

Do you really hang your hat and base your argument on Bret winning one more game his first year than Morris? Who gives a darn what Bret did before he came here, look how he did here.  It's not like we fired some badass winning coach and hired Morris.

4-8 in year five. 29-34. Losing record. I.e., a loser.

But go ahead and keep crying.

ATU HOG:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 12:12:51 pm ---Of course he wowed them. He's a con and a used car salesman. That's what makes him a good recruiter.

And JJ DID make the call to JCP. How do you think he got the interview?

Either way, we've never had a worse record from a coach's first season than this clown.

I'd like to know what you guys see that I don't? He's got High School connections. Great! What's that done for him on the sideline in college?

They are all over their heads. Especially on offense. I gave Chavis a pass because he's been around. But he better have the D a lot better this season. You guys want a winner so bad that you'll crown a loser because you wanted CBB gone!

I mean almost all of you were so sure of this guy last season and he bombed! Terribly!

What makes you think he's any different of a coach than last season? Stop blaming it on the players. When CBB was there we had no problem on offense. How many points did we score last year?

6 wins? Please. we will be lucky with 3-4-5. And even if that happens the apologists will be here saying he's great.

--- End quote ---
Season was a wash regardless, coaching staff realized that.  Don't think they or most people really cared too much about the record because everyone knew once the season got rolling that it wasn't going to be good.  Take a deep breath, hope for the best. 


oldhawg:


--- Quote from: UnknownNobody on March 12, 2019, 10:36:15 am ---Terry Don called Julie Cormer Peoples and put in a good word for Morris. Morris was given an interview after they had looked at other candidates and found them lacking. Morris came in prepared and blew the committee away.

It was a committee decision not JCP's decision. Jerry Jones was not on the committee. Terry Don Phillips was not on the committee.

--- End quote ---

Thanks.


UnknownNobody:


--- Quote from: Grizzlyfan on March 12, 2019, 12:05:14 pm ---There may very well have been some distortions.  But don't pretend for a second that Jerry Jones had no influence on this hire simply because he wasn't on the committee.

--- End quote ---

You assume this but know absolutely nothing. Show us proof.

You cannot because it is all supposition and conjecture.

HogX:


--- Quote from: Formula Hog on March 12, 2019, 12:12:51 pm ---Of course he wowed them. He's a con and a used car salesman. That's what makes him a good recruiter.

And JJ DID make the call to JCP. How do you think he got the interview?

Either way, we've never had a worse record from a coach's first season than this clown.

I'd like to know what you guys see that I don't? He's got High School connections. Great! What's that done for him on the sideline in college?

They are all over their heads. Especially on offense. I gave Chavis a pass because he's been around. But he better have the D a lot better this season. You guys want a winner so bad that you'll crown a loser because you wanted CBB gone!

I mean almost all of you were so sure of this guy last season and he bombed! Terribly!

What makes you think he's any different of a coach than last season? Stop blaming it on the players. When CBB was there we had no problem on offense. How many points did we score last year?

6 wins? Please. we will be lucky with 3-4-5. And even if that happens the apologists will be here saying he's great.

--- End quote ---

Nobody is crowning anybody.  Morris may very well be over his head.  Next season should give us a little more insight into that with him starting to bring in his own players.  We're just not going to root for a head coach to fail so we can say 'told you so' to a bunch of strangers on a message board. 

And yes, I know, "Nah, I don't root for the Hogs to lose".  I'm not buying that. You just can't say it out loud on here because it would invalidate everything you post.  Although defending Bret alone should do that. 

Formula Hog:

Again with the "show us the proof". Classic.

So what that I liked CBB? On paper he looked like the perfect fit. So it didn't work out? Big deal. I have no hangups with his record other than he didn't win enough. Most of y'all are mad because he got paid a bunch of money. Welcome to the business of big time college athletics.

But after all that money they were ready to throw at Gus(who was NEVER coming), this is what we got. And you know why? Because a lot of coaches were interested, winning coaches. But when the word got out on how much they dropped the pay after Gus said no, we got the only guy that really wanted to deal with us. All the agents put the word out. Jerry was pushing CCM.

And since some of you know so much, who exactly DID we offer or have interest in before and after Gus?

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