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Author Topic: Letís talk about the gap  (Read 3681 times)

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#hammerdown

Letís talk about the gap
« on: March 19, 2018, 09:17:03 pm »

No, not Michael Strahan ;-).  Iím talking about the splits on the offensive line.  I expect them to be vastly different this year.

Missouriís gaps were some of the largest I have seen.  Yet they ran the ball pretty effectively most of the time.

Our foot to foot and hip to hip alignment seemed to lead to a lot of solid walls of human flesh with no where for the back to run, even in short yardage.

If any of you are skilled in OLine play can you break down for us the advantage vs disadvantage of one style/alignment over the other and what we might expect this year?
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Pork Ranger

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2018, 09:21:51 pm »

I thought this was gonna be a thigh gap thread, what a disappointment..  however, I will agree Iíve seen some large gaps in MO as well
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Swestwill66

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2018, 09:31:12 pm »

I had a story to tell. Never mind...now.
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kodiakisland

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2018, 09:56:55 pm »

I don't know what we will see, but I bet we don't see play action on 3rd and long or delayed action runs on 3rd and short.
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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2018, 10:33:04 pm »

I've always considered the gap to be very important. It can really affect the angles.
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UA1985

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2018, 12:08:37 am »

Double edge sword. OL gets better angles on the DL and the additional space makes for larger holes. But the wider gaps make it more likely that a quick DT will shoot a gap and get into the backfield.
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Al Boarland

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2018, 04:27:56 am »

I don't know what we will see, but I bet we don't see play action on 3rd and long or delayed action runs on 3rd and short.

Letís be honest. No matter the play call people will not like it if it doesnít work.
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Sow Lancelot

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2018, 04:38:59 am »

I thought this was gonna be a thigh gap thread, what a disappointment..  however, I will agree Iíve seen some large gaps in MO as well
DST......well, not any more.
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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2018, 05:45:05 am »

No, not Michael Strahan ;-).  Iím talking about the splits on the offensive line.  I expect them to be vastly different this year.

Missouriís gaps were some of the largest I have seen.  Yet they ran the ball pretty effectively most of the time.

Our foot to foot and hip to hip alignment seemed to lead to a lot of solid walls of human flesh with no where for the back to run, even in short yardage.

If any of you are skilled in OLine play can you break down for us the advantage vs disadvantage of one style/alignment over the other and what we might expect this year?

Here's an article that mentions Morris at Clemson and some of his philosophy with a lot of detail about the various O-Line positions, their stance and splits.

To start we think its best to really explain the differences in the positions played and some alignment terminology before we start with the real differences between zone and gap scheme blocking. Since Chad Morris has said that we will switch out some of our zone schemes for gap schemes this season, presumably because gap is easier to teach and rep effectively, this should be important for understanding how our OL is playing next season.

Position demands change in each particular offense. Most pro-style systems will look for a blend of pass block and run block skills, but the linemen, paricularly the interior, end up larger and heavier. These teams run straight ahead most of the time. Option offenses will need mobile linemen who can pull really well and spread teams will go with the smaller guys who will usually be great pass blockers. Our offense is more of a blend of the latter two, since its developed from the WIng-T with a lot of downfield action put in.


https://www.shakinthesouthland.com/2012/4/30/2985335/offensive-line-positions-and-basics

And then there is this in terms of O-Line blocking responsibilities on several play calls/alignments.

We'll now look at a couple power and speed variations of this play.  If you take this base play, pull both guards to the playside and use the fullback to seal for the backside guard, the result is the famous "Buck Sweep," shown below.

Up-front there is a scoop from the backside tackle.  As mentioned earlier, both guards pull.  The playside tackle, wing, and the tight end rule block "Down-Gap-Backer" (or "Gap-Down-Backer," depending on the line coach).  This is a basic concept with the three parts going as follows:

    Down-Block: Angle block on the defender head up on the offensive lineman immediately inside
    Gap: Protect the gap immediately inside
    Backer: Seek a block at the second level

Simply, Down-Gap-Backer means the first responsibility is a down block.  If there is no down block to be made, protect your inside gap.  If there is no one shooting this gap, move on to the next level.  Gap-Down-Backer makes gap protection a higher priority than the down block.  In most plays from the wing-t, the majority of the playside linemen block DGB and the backside linemen will get a scoop/reach.


https://www.shakinthesouthland.com/2011/6/9/2188729/inside-the-morris-offense-wing-t-roots
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twistitup

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2018, 06:46:21 am »

Protect the gap
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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2018, 08:12:40 am »

Here's an article that mentions Morris at Clemson and some of his philosophy with a lot of detail about the various O-Line positions, their stance and splits.

To start we think its best to really explain the differences in the positions played and some alignment terminology before we start with the real differences between zone and gap scheme blocking. Since Chad Morris has said that we will switch out some of our zone schemes for gap schemes this season, presumably because gap is easier to teach and rep effectively, this should be important for understanding how our OL is playing next season.

Position demands change in each particular offense. Most pro-style systems will look for a blend of pass block and run block skills, but the linemen, paricularly the interior, end up larger and heavier. These teams run straight ahead most of the time. Option offenses will need mobile linemen who can pull really well and spread teams will go with the smaller guys who will usually be great pass blockers. Our offense is more of a blend of the latter two, since its developed from the WIng-T with a lot of downfield action put in.


https://www.shakinthesouthland.com/2012/4/30/2985335/offensive-line-positions-and-basics

And then there is this in terms of O-Line blocking responsibilities on several play calls/alignments.

We'll now look at a couple power and speed variations of this play.  If you take this base play, pull both guards to the playside and use the fullback to seal for the backside guard, the result is the famous "Buck Sweep," shown below.

Up-front there is a scoop from the backside tackle.  As mentioned earlier, both guards pull.  The playside tackle, wing, and the tight end rule block "Down-Gap-Backer" (or "Gap-Down-Backer," depending on the line coach).  This is a basic concept with the three parts going as follows:

    Down-Block: Angle block on the defender head up on the offensive lineman immediately inside
    Gap: Protect the gap immediately inside
    Backer: Seek a block at the second level

Simply, Down-Gap-Backer means the first responsibility is a down block.  If there is no down block to be made, protect your inside gap.  If there is no one shooting this gap, move on to the next level.  Gap-Down-Backer makes gap protection a higher priority than the down block.  In most plays from the wing-t, the majority of the playside linemen block DGB and the backside linemen will get a scoop/reach.


https://www.shakinthesouthland.com/2011/6/9/2188729/inside-the-morris-offense-wing-t-roots

Thanks the Bucksweep as great old Wing T staple.
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nwahogfan1

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2018, 08:32:44 am »

Putting players in motion, faking in the back field and having one or two OLM pulling are 3 great ways to confuse  and out flank the defense.  These are designed to either slowing down the DLM or getting them to chase the fake or running with the motion/pulling OLM and this makes it so much easier for our OLM to block.  But we must understand there will be times the defense guesses right or gets lucky enough to stunt in the right place at the right time.  This is when a play blows up and we get a loss yardage play.   

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #12 on: March 20, 2018, 10:44:02 am »

I don't know what we will see, but I bet we don't see play action on 3rd and long or delayed action runs on 3rd and short.

we can hope!

that drove me insane. play action can work really good when you don't needs the yards, but 3d and long - NOPE.
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Hoggish1

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #13 on: March 20, 2018, 10:46:48 am »

No, not Michael Strahan ;-).  Iím talking about the splits on the offensive line.  I expect them to be vastly different this year.

Missouriís gaps were some of the largest I have seen.  Yet they ran the ball pretty effectively most of the time.

Our foot to foot and hip to hip alignment seemed to lead to a lot of solid walls of human flesh with no where for the back to run, even in short yardage.

If any of you are skilled in OLine play can you break down for us the advantage vs disadvantage of one style/alignment over the other and what we might expect this year?

When you have linemen who can move you have wide gaps.  When you have big road graders you tighten up and plow.  We will now have the former.
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DeltaBoy

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #14 on: March 20, 2018, 01:13:10 pm »

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tusked

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #15 on: March 20, 2018, 03:18:15 pm »


Interesting info with plays.  Pretty sure this is what CM runs.

http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/document/0101/8074/Delaware_Wing_T_-_Coach_Thurman.pdf
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twistitup

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2018, 06:48:16 pm »

I believe he calls it the Morris Gap T
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sickboy

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #17 on: March 20, 2018, 09:48:39 pm »



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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #18 on: March 21, 2018, 09:03:16 am »

H&M is better.
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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #19 on: March 21, 2018, 11:28:25 am »

Interesting info with plays.  Pretty sure this is what CM runs.

http://assets.ngin.com/attachments/document/0101/8074/Delaware_Wing_T_-_Coach_Thurman.pdf
I love that offense. that was the 1st one I ever learned back at Belton Junior High lol.
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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #20 on: March 21, 2018, 11:49:21 am »

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BigSexyHog

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #21 on: March 21, 2018, 03:21:42 pm »

Not interested
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WJBilly

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #22 on: March 21, 2018, 04:04:50 pm »

I thought this was gonna be a thigh gap thread, what a disappointment..  however, I will agree Iíve seen some large gaps in MO as well
This is what I though of.
Couldn't find the Col.Potter version.
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HenduHog

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #23 on: March 21, 2018, 07:45:06 pm »

Fill the GAP!

No protect the gap.

Meaning keep the gap open for the running back. If the O-line FILLS the gap that means there is no hole for the RB.

 That's the defense's job. FILL the gap.
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Inhogswetrust

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #24 on: March 21, 2018, 07:51:21 pm »

No protect the gap.

Meaning keep the gap open for the running back. If the O-line FILLS the gap that means there is no hole for the RB.

 That's the defense's job. FILL the gap.

I believe you and he are talking about a different gap..............
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twistitup

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #25 on: March 21, 2018, 08:34:29 pm »

I believe you and he are talking about a different gap..............

You talking about this gap?

https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/auditing/gap-ghp

or this one

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Mike Irwin

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2018, 09:51:26 pm »

I thought maybe it was this gap.
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twistitup

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #27 on: March 21, 2018, 09:53:39 pm »

or this gap

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Inhogswetrust

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #28 on: March 22, 2018, 07:34:17 am »

Best gap I ever saw.......Lauren Hutton.  Teeth gap I mean.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 11:44:12 am by Inhogswetrust »
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MrKnowItAll

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #29 on: March 22, 2018, 09:10:12 am »

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #30 on: March 22, 2018, 09:53:57 am »

I love that offense. that was the 1st one I ever learned back at Belton Junior High lol.

Donít shoot the messenger.  Itís the foundation for CMís offense.
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PorkRinds

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #31 on: March 23, 2018, 03:15:16 pm »

I thought maybe it was this gap.

We have the Michael Strahan of football stadiums.
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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #32 on: March 28, 2018, 11:37:56 am »

No, not Michael Strahan ;-).  Iím talking about the splits on the offensive line.  I expect them to be vastly different this year.

Missouriís gaps were some of the largest I have seen.  Yet they ran the ball pretty effectively most of the time.

Our foot to foot and hip to hip alignment seemed to lead to a lot of solid walls of human flesh with no where for the back to run, even in short yardage.

If any of you are skilled in OLine play can you break down for us the advantage vs disadvantage of one style/alignment over the other and what we might expect this year?
I don't think Coach B believes in outside zone blocking.  Coach Morris will in fact create a tandum and coach his oline to determine (with their eyes) who will reach for backer.  It will probably look like a chinese fire drill for a year. 
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LJHOG

Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #33 on: April 03, 2018, 01:05:19 pm »

We have to keep the gap between o linemen small.  They are not athletic enough to cover even semi-wide gaps.
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DeltaBoy

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Re: Letís talk about the gap
« Reply #34 on: April 03, 2018, 02:52:24 pm »

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