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Author Topic: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy  (Read 4153 times)

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MuskogeeHogFan

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Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« on: March 09, 2018, 05:27:06 am »

Some of you may remember Murf Baldwin and some of his postings here on Hogville a few years back. He always did a good job of explaining the different topics on which he posted and provided video to help the reader see what he was writing about. Here, he talks about Chavis in an article that was written at a time when "The Chief" was hired at A&M. It is a good article and here are some excerpts.

Heís a two-time assistant coach of the year who can recruit with the best of them. The NFL is littered with players of name value who came up under the tutelage of the Chief: Patrick Peterson (Arizona Cardinals), Tyrann Mathieu (Cardinals), Eric Reid San Francisco 49ers), Barkevious Mingo (Cleveland Browns), Kevin Minter (Cardinals), Bennie Logan (Philadelphia Eagles) and Tharold Simon (Seattle Seahawks)Öand that was just the 2013 draft class (sans Peterson)!

Chavisí background is with linebackers but his scheme has evolved over the years to become defensive-back centric. He truly runs an even-front hybrid as on the surface itís ď43,Ē but his adaptability with todayís fast-paced high-octane offenses has him running more of a sub-package base.

Operating out of a 4-2-5 ó not in normal responsibility, more like personnel grouping ó  can be tricky as it takes the right kind of personnel. Many think itís as easy as pulling a second-level defender for a nickel corner. But if you really want to be able to still stop the run you need hybrid players on the back end.

Chavis isnít most coaches; heís a savant who understands that providing quarterbacks with multiple looks throughout a tilt will ultimately cause confusion. He also believes that having speed on defense can erase the rudimentary mistakes one might find on an average series of downs.

My favorite package from Chavis during his time with LSU was one he referred to as the ďMustangĒ package ó where he would bring in a sixth defensive back ó which is a cooler way to say ďDimeĒ defense.

As a 3-2-6-based package, you would think that the scheme would be light on pressure, but Chavis cross-trains his DBs to be able to blitz.

And when you have so much speed on the field, the pressure can literally come from just about anywhere.

Fabricated-pressure schemes have been a way of life for Chavis since way back. And most know, if youíre going to go the way of manufactured pressure you better have solid corners who are adept at both press- and off-man coverage ó like Peterson and former No. 6 overall pick Morris Claiborne.

You also have to have off-the-ball linebackers who can play in reverse as well as they play moving forward to tackle. But most importantly, you need one-gap penetrating linemen who can quickly disrupt a play.


So do we have the personnel to help Chavis run this defense as designed? If not, what "tweaks" might have to be made to resemble the defense he wants to produce?

There's a lot more inside, including video clips.

https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/tamu-football/film-study-chavis-game-changer-epic-proportions/
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2018, 05:39:39 am »

And, here is more on Chavis' philosophy from SB Nation.

I. The foundation: Personnel choices

At linebacker, the Tigers tend to go for athletes in the 220-to-240-pound range who can hold up well enough in coverage, change direction on the run, and shoot into the backfield with explosiveness on a blitz or after diagnosing a play.

And in the secondary, despite relying heavily on man coverage, the Tigers rarely make exceptions in their quest to find the rangiest athletes available. Adding up all their defensive backs taken in 2015 (thus far) back to 2010, you'll find 17 of their 21 DBs were at least six feet tall. Exceptions were made for Tyrann Mathieu and Micah Eugene for obvious reasons, as both players had extraordinary quickness.

When it comes time to play a spread team, LSU has no shortage of tall, physical pass-rushers and defensive backs to shrink the field back down when spread teams try to use wide alignments to spread them out.

IV. Tactics: Anti-spread schemes

Chavis' 4-3 defense is pretty standard and similar to what you see at other programs across the country. The Tigers rely mostly on the over front, which gets the ends on the edge and safely away from double teams, and they use a standard combination of quarters coverage and single-deep safety coverages.

Where LSU is different from other teams and where they draw some anti-spread advantages are in the way they use robber coverage, press coverage, and their famous mustang.

Like many other teams, LSU typically responds to a trips set (three receivers on one side of the formation) with a particular type of cover 1/cover 3 called robber. The difference for the Tigers is that their strong safeties can play in soft coverage and either break on the ball or arrive at the line of scrimmage in time to make plays against the run game.


https://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2014/5/15/5709380/lsu-defense-john-chavis-spread-offenses
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ChitownHawg

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2018, 06:00:38 am »

Can you imagine what Chief would have done with Flowers, Spaight, and Philon?
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2018, 06:04:17 am »

Can you imagine what Chief would have done with Flowers, Spaight, and Philon?

Oh yeah, but the question is, what is he going to be able to do with what we have here? Already seeing a move of Curl to Safety.
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jgphillips3

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2018, 07:06:46 am »

Oh yeah, but the question is, what is he going to be able to do with what we have here? Already seeing a move of Curl to Safety.

I like the secondary he is putting on the field (Ramirez, Curl, Pulley & Calloway) and I think our front is a lot more suited to one gap attacking than they way we have been utilizing them.  The linebackers should finally be a productive group too.  I think we have a chance to be a solid D this year.
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ChitownHawg

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2018, 07:18:32 am »

Oh yeah, but the question is, what is he going to be able to do with what we have here? Already seeing a move of Curl to Safety.

Iíll take his word when he says there are some pieces and speed here. But we need more.

Iíll be happy this year if we just compete hard for four quarters.

And continue recruiting to fill in the gaps.
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oldbear

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2018, 08:06:40 am »

I really beliieve that this is the type of scheme Arkansas desperately needs to even the playing field. If I am understanding correctly, Chief brings pressure often, but brings it from a different place pretty much every time. In my min this is a great equalizer.

Causing confusion to the offense allows you to make up for athletic deficiency. I have seen this hold true for several years now in high school games and believe it translates well to the college level. We have been trying to rely too long on getting someone up front to just straight up win. We simply don't have enough freaks to accomplish this.

Sounds like Chavis really is the answer.
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DeltaBoy

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2018, 08:12:20 am »

I am glad we got the Chief.
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Vantage 8 dude

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2018, 09:38:01 am »

I've said it more than once, however, I will again: I honestly believe that the amount of improvement (if any) will be a HUGE key to how well we can compete this next year. From everything I've read and observed our offense SHOULD be alright, at least hold their own, even if we might not have quite the depth of top level kids that we'll need down the road. IMO it's primarily been the defensive side of the ball that been the most inconsistent area year in-year out over the past five or six years. While we've obviously had some outstanding players such as Spaight, Philon and Flowers, we've also lacked overall speed, sound techniques and aggressiveness. That type of talent isn't going to be recruited overnight, however, what we CAN do is make up for some of that by playing with sold fundamentals-sure tackling, not playing soft coverages and actually pressuring the QB on a more regular basis.

As an old timer I remember "back in the day"-the 60s, 70s, 80s and even into the 90's and early 2000 time frame-when one thing you could count on virtually every year was a very "salty" Hog defense. They would hit you hard, hit you often and they would cover your WRs like glue. We need to rediscover that formula and begin to make our opponents fear taking the field against us.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2018, 10:45:22 am by Vantage 8 dude »
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HognitiveDissonance

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2018, 10:11:34 am »

--->The NFL is littered with players of name value who came up under the tutelage of the Chief---->


I can never see this word without thinking of the Bum Phillips quote:
"I never tuteled that boy."
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ricepig

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2018, 10:19:41 am »

Iíll take his word when he says there are some pieces and speed here. But we need more.

Iíll be happy this year if we just compete hard for four quarters.

And continue recruiting to fill in the gaps.

We recruited some good secondary talent the past two years. They will be raw, but more speed than just graduated. I always thought Curl was a safety, I remember when Brown was wavering at the end of his recruitment and people were saying he felt he was lied to about being the only safety in the class, and that Curl would play CB. I think once Pulley/Tutt were hurt that Curl was the next physically ready to play CB, but was a true safety. Fitzpatrick played all over the field for Bama, Curl can for us.
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Dark Helmet Hog

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2018, 10:40:02 am »

It will be nice just to see more of an attacking style defense rather than the bend but don't break disaster that we have seen.
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3Scoreand10

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2018, 12:32:09 pm »

It will be nice just to see more of an attacking style defense rather than the bend but don't break disaster that we have seen.

Actually our defense has been bent UNTIL break lately.
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drizzle

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2018, 01:36:01 pm »

It will be nice just to see more of an attacking style defense rather than the bend but don't break disaster that we have seen.

Actually our defense has been bent UNTIL break lately.

Seems we saw more break than bend.  Maybe it was pre-bent.
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bennyl08

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2018, 02:08:50 pm »



So do we have the personnel to help Chavis run this defense as designed? If not, what "tweaks" might have to be made to resemble the defense he wants to produce?

There's a lot more inside, including video clips.

https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/tamu-football/film-study-chavis-game-changer-epic-proportions/

DE: We have lots of guys with the speed and explosion. Porter, Taylor, Agim, Gerald, and possibly Bell.

DT: Guidry is very much in the Philon mold of explosion. New kid Ferrell looks to be very fast as well. TJ was 30 pounds ago, no idea if he will be able to maintain that at 300+. Marshall isn't terribly explosive but isn't terribly lacking and probably our best all around as he is very balanced in skill. Capps is probably our slowest, but also probably one of the strongest players in the SEC.

LB: Harris is elite and Greenlaw is good. Morgan was also very productive in limited reps last year. After that, a lot of players we haven't had time to see much. I think AJB can be very good and Bumper coming in certainly looks to have the requisite athleticism. Otherwise, I think our LB depth is better than it has been in a long time, but I think most of the guys would be SEC level average. Which to even have our backups be that good is well above average for us, but I don't think we have a ton of guys who are going to be at that upper level of athleticism. Which is going to be true of most teams. So, unless Chavis is planning on coaching at Ohio St or something, that we even have the guys he needs at least in the first string and maybe a backup or two who are good enough is probably the best he could hope for at most any any school.

CB: In truth, we only have one truly proven player here. However, in potential and depth from top to bottom, I don't know if we've every been this well off in my lifetime of nearly ~30 years. 2 extra thoughts to add, first is Jordan Curtis. While he's not getting a lot of talk now, when it's all said and done, I think people will be talking about him right up there with everyone else. Secondly, and in a similar vein, even beyond the big names that we've signed, I think we have a number of Cobi Hamiltons here as well. When Cobi was here, he was behind Childs, Wright, and Adams and for good reason. However, he was a guy that at any other time would have been a top dog, which we saw in 2012. Guys like Hernandez and McClellion remind me of that. Good chance they'll be behind the big dogs of Calloway and Curtis, but that isn't to say they don't game in their own rights.

S: Similar to CB. We have Ramirez who is actually our only truly proven player here, but are oozing potential.
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HoggyCat

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2018, 03:30:16 pm »

Even in our shorthanded talent years, had we not had that big 10 mentality we wouldíve been a lot better. Lack of creative blitzing and a 10 yard cushion cost us several games. 
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bennyl08

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2018, 03:44:18 pm »

Even in our shorthanded talent years, had we not had that big 10 mentality we wouldíve been a lot better. Lack of creative blitzing and a 10 yard cushion cost us several games.

Chavis often uses the big cushions as well. Especially if he is blitzing. Heck, the interception you see in Chavis's film room sessions is him using a big cushion.

I don't think it's a big 10 mentality so much as a scared mentality and wanting to play it safe. You see the bend but don't break in every conference. Robb Smith played aggressive defenses before coming here and his first year here and we were gearing up to do so in 2016 all off-season before getting cold feet when the season started.
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RoyHobbs92

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #17 on: March 09, 2018, 04:02:19 pm »

"Wh-What-What happens is, the-the-the center ha-has the ball first. And-And-And the quarterback will say, 'Hike.' That's when the c center puts the ball in-into the hands of-of the quarterback. So, what I do is, I-I start tacklin' the quarterback, un-unless he gives the ball to-to s somebody else, in which case, I-I try to tackle that person." Defensive philosophy of Bobby Boucher
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bennyl08

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2018, 04:45:41 pm »

"Wh-What-What happens is, the-the-the center ha-has the ball first. And-And-And the quarterback will say, 'Hike.' That's when the c center puts the ball in-into the hands of-of the quarterback. So, what I do is, I-I start tacklin' the quarterback, un-unless he gives the ball to-to s somebody else, in which case, I-I try to tackle that person." Defensive philosophy of Bobby Boucher

Oh yeah, that reminds me. Don't. Do. Crack.
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Rudy Baylor

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2018, 06:27:19 pm »

We recruited some good secondary talent the past two years. They will be raw, but more speed than just graduated. I always thought Curl was a safety, I remember when Brown was wavering at the end of his recruitment and people were saying he felt he was lied to about being the only safety in the class, and that Curl would play CB. I think once Pulley/Tutt were hurt that Curl was the next physically ready to play CB, but was a true safety. Fitzpatrick played all over the field for Bama, Curl can for us.

one definition of "true safety" means you're not fast enough or quick enough to play corner

if you're quick enough to be a corner, you play corner
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #20 on: March 09, 2018, 06:47:07 pm »

one definition of "true safety" means you're not fast enough or quick enough to play corner

if you're quick enough to be a corner, you play corner

That might be a poorly stated definition for the following reasons.

On any given play, a Safety is tasked with running the alley to stop the run or turning and running in coverage. Safeties are constantly moving towards the ball, and they have more ground to cover than anyone else on the team to get there, so speed is important.

A Safety must be fast enough to pursue the run in front of him by shutting down alleys before the runner gets through the first and second levels of the defense but he must also have enough burst to accelerate out of his breaks and attack the ball going both forward (toward the run) and backward (in coverage).

The ideal Safety is as athletic as a CB and as tough as a LB. The ability to make a sound tackle is an important trait of a top-tier Safety.

There are good Safeties who don't possess great speed, but those players make up for it with exceptional instincts. It's good to have one or the other, but the best Safeties have a combination of instincts, athletic ability and speed as well.

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ricepig

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2018, 06:51:46 pm »

one definition of "true safety" means you're not fast enough or quick enough to play corner

if you're quick enough to be a corner, you play corner

Fitzpatrick ran a 4.46, I guess that's fast and not quick.
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Rudy Baylor

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2018, 09:51:46 pm »

That might be a poorly stated definition for the following reasons.

On any given play, a Safety is tasked with running the alley to stop the run or turning and running in coverage. Safeties are constantly moving towards the ball, and they have more ground to cover than anyone else on the team to get there, so speed is important.

A Safety must be fast enough to pursue the run in front of him by shutting down alleys before the runner gets through the first and second levels of the defense but he must also have enough burst to accelerate out of his breaks and attack the ball going both forward (toward the run) and backward (in coverage).

The ideal Safety is as athletic as a CB and as tough as a LB. The ability to make a sound tackle is an important trait of a top-tier Safety.

There are good Safeties who don't possess great speed, but those players make up for it with exceptional instincts. It's good to have one or the other, but the best Safeties have a combination of instincts, athletic ability and speed as well.


I was partly being facetious to ricepig

as for your post, safeties never read run first. They read pass first on their initial steps, then play the run. The only exception to that would be a called safety blitz

Safeties are actually better overall athletes than corners. Who are better basketball players usually off the court for instance? Safeties are.

As for raw quickness, safeties are quick. Corners are quicker. Some corners only run a 4.6, but they're quick as cats.

all DB's must be sound tacklers - anyone starting on the defense at all must be sound tacklers

"Safeties have a combination of instincts, athletic ability and speed as well." - that's absolutely true
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systemroot

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #23 on: March 09, 2018, 11:39:02 pm »

Speed kills Arkansas every year over the past few years. We can talk all day long about philosophy and how it sounds good on paper but he has got to get out there and recruit players with true speed. If he has to develop them in other areas, I do not think it would be much of an issue.

Someone correct me if I am wrong but I was not too impressed with Chavis' job at Texas A&M so I am not too sure how I truly feel about his hiring as DC.
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #24 on: March 10, 2018, 05:27:07 am »


I was partly being facetious to ricepig

as for your post, safeties never read run first. They read pass first on their initial steps, then play the run. The only exception to that would be a called safety blitz

Safeties are actually better overall athletes than corners. Who are better basketball players usually off the court for instance? Safeties are.

As for raw quickness, safeties are quick. Corners are quicker. Some corners only run a 4.6, but they're quick as cats.

all DB's must be sound tacklers - anyone starting on the defense at all must be sound tacklers

"Safeties have a combination of instincts, athletic ability and speed as well." - that's absolutely true

I didn't say that Safeties read "run" first.

As for CB's, many of the same traits that make a good Safety can be found in CB's...instincts, athletic ability and speed, but the best CB's possess the all-important trait of being able to "flip their hips" and quickly transition from running one direction (including back peddling) to running in a different direction.

CB's can possess great instincts, technique and speed, but if they can't quickly transition the direction of their hips in coverage they may never be really good CB's. Having "quick feet" is also a necessity that obviously aids the quick hip-flip. This is probably one of the biggest factors in deciding who might be a Safety and who might be a more ideal CB.

Most CB's of the recent past have not been known for being great tacklers, but the best ones are sure tacklers. Tackling with excellent technique (across the board on defense) has almost become a lost art form, but with offenses spreading defenses out across the field these days it is important that CB's learn to execute sound tackles. We have all seen what a missed tackle out on the edge can produce. A potential lost yardage or 5 yard gain can turn into a 15 or 20 yard play or heaven forbid, a TD.

So I agree with much of what you say about CB's though I would add that in these days of bigger receivers it would be nice if you could field CB's that are 6-0, 6-1, maybe even 6-2 so that they can better defend the height advantage of taller receivers. The problem is finding those guys with that height who also possess the other needed traits.

As all of this relates to this thread topic, we are probably going to see Chavis dialing up a variety of pressures from different directions and we will likely see some Corner blitzes as well. I'm looking forward to greater creativity in this area.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2018, 07:28:11 am by MuskogeeHogFan »
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twistitup

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2018, 08:49:23 am »

Chief Chavis will take our defense to places we haven't been....
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jbigs77

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2018, 10:04:22 am »

I enjoyed reading this thread. Good input from many. I would like to add something I think is relevant.  Preparation for the teams being played at a particular time. If the players are properly prepared, they will recognize formations and will understand their responsibilities for that play. If you know what to do and know where to go, you will get there faster.
One of the more frustrating things in recent past years, that I have seen was player (and coaches) confusion. A general lack of knowledge of what to do and where to go. Talent will only get you so far, with out knowledge and understanding you will fail more times than not. If you have a player(s) with talent, knowledge and understanding, then you have what I call a difference maker(s). That is what wins games. Knowledge and understanding is gained from good coaching. Hopefully we have that now.
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2018, 10:08:24 am »

Chief Chavis will take our defense to places we haven't been....

Not sure about that, but I do believe that he will improve our performance as a defense.

Just out of curiosity I went back and looked at the 2016 regular season, bowl games not included, to see what Chavis had done with the A&M defense in terms of pressure.

That season and to that date, the end of the regular season, A&M had 36 sacks (#15 nationally, 2nd in the SEC), we had 21 (#88 nationally). That was 1 sack in every 12.3 passing attempts for A&M.

They also had 49 QB Hurries (4th in the SEC) to our 26.

So their total pressures (Sacks + Hurries) that season were 85 (4th in the SEC) with 1 pressure in every 5.2 passing attempts. For Arkansas we were at 47 pressures or 1 in every 7.1 passing attempts.

"The Chief" is going to bring more pressure, no doubt about that. The key will be how well our Secondary covers receivers. Throws are probably going to come more quickly so if we are playing off the receivers more we are probably going to allow more catches. That's ok if we tackle the receiver on the spot and not allow them to gain more YAC.

Many folks these days think that defensive football isn't exciting, but I think that we may have some exciting days ahead of us on both offense and defense.
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oldhawg

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #28 on: March 10, 2018, 11:27:36 am »

Not sure about that, but I do believe that he will improve our performance as a defense.

Just out of curiosity I went back and looked at the 2016 regular season, bowl games not included, to see what Chavis had done with the A&M defense in terms of pressure.

That season and to that date, the end of the regular season, A&M had 36 sacks (#15 nationally, 2nd in the SEC), we had 21 (#88 nationally). That was 1 sack in every 12.3 passing attempts for A&M.

They also had 49 QB Hurries (4th in the SEC) to our 26.

So their total pressures (Sacks + Hurries) that season were 85 (4th in the SEC) with 1 pressure in every 5.2 passing attempts. For Arkansas we were at 47 pressures or 1 in every 7.1 passing attempts.

"The Chief" is going to bring more pressure, no doubt about that. The key will be how well our Secondary covers receivers. Throws are probably going to come more quickly so if we are playing off the receivers more we are probably going to allow more catches. That's ok if we tackle the receiver on the spot and not allow them to gain more YAC.

Many folks these days think that defensive football isn't exciting, but I think that we may have some exciting days ahead of us on both offense and defense.

Likewise, I really enjoy watching an effective defense go about its business.  Its every bit as exciting as an effective offense.  Hope we are in store for both at Arkansas the for the next few years.  This year progress is what I am looking for, especially on defense. 
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Pudgepork

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #29 on: March 10, 2018, 11:29:02 am »

Improvements are on the horizon for every position group on this team. Hopefully, major upgrades in special teams.  Just needs a little time to pull it all together
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twistitup

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #30 on: March 10, 2018, 02:21:02 pm »

Quality LB depth has been needed for years - I think we will finally be able to draw those recruits here with Chavis as DC
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Bacons Rebellion

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #31 on: March 10, 2018, 05:23:12 pm »

Chief Chavis will take our defense to places we haven't been....

Our defense has never been to Colorado.
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twistitup

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #32 on: March 10, 2018, 06:49:38 pm »

Our defense has never been to Colorado.

Hopefully all of our players come back w/o going defecting
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SooieGeneris

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #33 on: March 10, 2018, 09:33:23 pm »

one definition of "true safety" means you're not fast enough or quick enough to play corner

if you're quick enough to be a corner, you play corner

That might have been true 10 years ago, but not now. Minkah Fitzpatrick is being talked about as a possible CB in the NFL as the draft approaches, played safety at 'Bama.

Ask Austin Allen if Fitzpatrick could play CB after that 100+ yard INT he made in 2016. With all the spread 4-5 wide receiver looks and hurry up offenses, if a safety can't cover man to man, they will get torched.

The role of that position has changed a lot in the last few years. I won't mention names, but it was a very common sight to see one of our starters at safety the past 2-3 years grasping for air as an opposing WR or back ran right by him in space like the roadrunner leaving Wile E. Coyote in the dust..
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SooieGeneris

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #34 on: March 10, 2018, 09:45:36 pm »


I was partly being facetious to ricepig

as for your post, safeties never read run first. They read pass first on their initial steps, then play the run. The only exception to that would be a called safety blitz

Safeties are actually better overall athletes than corners. Who are better basketball players usually off the court for instance? Safeties are.

As for raw quickness, safeties are quick. Corners are quicker. Some corners only run a 4.6, but they're quick as cats.

all DB's must be sound tacklers - anyone starting on the defense at all must be sound tacklers

"Safeties have a combination of instincts, athletic ability and speed as well." - that's absolutely true

Disagree. Safeties need to be physically stronger and tougher than CBs, but there are many examples of pros who transition to safety from CB toward the end of their careers. Ronnie Lott and Rod Woodson and others played at a high level at safety in their mid-30s after starting at CB for years.

They were not better athletes at 35 than they were at 25... but they could anticipate better and knew the game better. How many guys start at safety for years, then switch to CB? I can't think of any..
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HogFoo

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #35 on: March 11, 2018, 12:27:40 am »

Oh yeah, but the question is, what is he going to be able to do with what we have here? Already seeing a move of Curl to Safety.
it seems to me the focus on defense has been DEs and Dbs.   When Chavis was at atm they used their excellent Dbs in man and their great DEs to collapse the pocket.  Usually letting the LBS finish off the qb or rb whenever they scrambled when the play broke down.  Atm moved that armani kid to safety which is similar to us moving curl to safety.  We have recruited depth at dB this last class as well as a few DEs,  of course it's not enough, and that's why we are going after more.  To answer questions, yes we will be able to recruit what Chavis wants to run his defense.  I have no doubt our starting defense will be good. We'll just be lacking on depth.  We will get there though.  Morris and staff can recruit! 
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #36 on: March 11, 2018, 06:43:06 am »

it seems to me the focus on defense has been DEs and Dbs.   When Chavis was at atm they used their excellent Dbs in man and their great DEs to collapse the pocket.  Usually letting the LBS finish off the qb or rb whenever they scrambled when the play broke down.  Atm moved that armani kid to safety which is similar to us moving curl to safety.  We have recruited depth at dB this last class as well as a few DEs,  of course it's not enough, and that's why we are going after more.  To answer questions, yes we will be able to recruit what Chavis wants to run his defense.  I have no doubt our starting defense will be good. We'll just be lacking on depth.  We will get there though.  Morris and staff can recruit! 

Mike Irwin reported that there were 9 Sacks recorded in this scrimmage. Of course there were quick whistles because QB's are non-contact but even if one could say that we had 4 Sacks and 5 QB Hurries, I would say that is an improvement in our strategy in terms of front 7 play. It's very early and all but I like the change in focus with Chavis.
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The NewEra

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #37 on: March 11, 2018, 11:00:15 am »

This has been a good thread to read.  Many good points have been made.  Thanks for a good football topic Muskogee.

I like the fact that Morris and his staff don't back away from the fact that we will play this year with the talent we have on campus now, barring a few potential late edition contributors.  Morris states that it's the coaches job to develop the talent they have now.  We are about to see just how well this staff can coach and develop talent as they put them in the scheme they plan to compete with.

I believe Hog fans are going to be pretty darned impressed with the development these players make under Tru Carroll and Chavis staff.  Chavis style of defense is just what the doctor ordered to get the most out of the players we do have.  I expect to see equal development on the offensive side of the ball as well.
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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #38 on: March 11, 2018, 11:25:37 am »

This has been a good thread to read.  Many good points have been made.  Thanks for a good football topic Muskogee.

I like the fact that Morris and his staff don't back away from the fact that we will play this year with the talent we have on campus now, barring a few potential late edition contributors.  Morris states that it's the coaches job to develop the talent they have now.  We are about to see just how well this staff can coach and develop talent as they put them in the scheme they plan to compete with.

I believe Hog fans are going to be pretty darned impressed with the development these players make under Tru Carroll and Chavis staff.  Chavis style of defense is just what the doctor ordered to get the most out of the players we do have.  I expect to see equal development on the offensive side of the ball as well.

I enjoy discussing the current football program, so thanks.

We are going to see some moves made and probably see some players who haven't been mentioned a great deal in the past, mentioned more frequently. It appears that Jamario Bell is one of these. Ramsey, though a regular in the past, seems to be re-energized. The move of Curl to Safety is probably a good one and if you listen to his interview yesterday, he sounds as if he is "all in" with the move.

Morris has already said that though there is work that still needs to be done, he is impressed with the work of the O-Line (which should be good news for a lot of fans). He also indicated that he was pleased with the TE's (who may play some H-Back) though everyone needs to be in better shape to maintain the quicker pace throughout practice.

I like the direction that they are going with this program. There is good news about various position groups and individuals and room for a lot of improvement as well, which we would expect to hear at this point. We might just surprise some people this fall. I certainly hope that is the case.
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HogFoo

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #39 on: March 12, 2018, 06:40:35 am »

Mike Irwin reported that there were 9 Sacks recorded in this scrimmage. Of course there were quick whistles because QB's are non-contact but even if one could say that we had 4 Sacks and 5 QB Hurries, I would say that is an improvement in our strategy in terms of front 7 play. It's very early and all but I like the change in focus with Chavis.
ive spoke with folks who say Agim looks like a complete beast right now. Dropped weight and is quick as ever!  Ive watched film of Gerald. He too is quick and hard to handle for opposing linemen.  I believe that these two together are going to be every bit as good as any Chavis has ever coached, from those two he had at aTm, to the ones he had at Lsu to any he had at tenner.  If Gerald is half as good as he looks on film , then we may lead the SEC in sacks this year!  It would not surprise me if Agim leads not only the SEC but is one of top in country in sacks.  He looks like an NFL player.  This is a money year for him. And he will make a lot from how he plays this year.   

Of course , being able to get to the QB also is due to how well our dbs can cover. Pulley returning, helps immediately, calloway being a year improved, curl moving to safety, i think our secondary will be fine.  What helps them the most tho is when the DEs are able to pressure the QB.  Its a hand in hand kind of deal.  Our DEs will definitely be able to lend a hand to our DBs. The only drop off will be depth. Whos gonna be putting the heat on QBs when Agim and gerald are getting breath?  I dont think we have the same caliber talent as them waiting to come in. Although i do think Fulwider will be a stud eventually.  I like Ferrell as well. Very quick, reminds me of Philon.  How bielema hadnt offered him is crazy!

I definitely like Chavis and i believe that we'll have a pretty good defense, especially if we can find depth. 

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nchogg

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #40 on: March 12, 2018, 07:49:27 am »

As I have said in an earlier post is that Agim had not been used by the previous coaching staff playing his strengths. I agree that Agim will be a terror for QB's.
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jkstock04

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #41 on: March 12, 2018, 08:35:36 am »

As I have said in an earlier post is that Agim had not been used by the previous coaching staff playing his strengths. I agree that Agim will be a terror for QB's.
Agreed with this completely. Watching him in that weak 4 point stance all season was painful. As a whole, the d line was set up for failure last year.

To the OP, good thread with more specific info on Chavis. In laymanís terms Iíd say itís safe to say we will have a much more aggressive defensive look than we are used to. One thing we are not talking about in this thread is how is Morrisí offense going to compliment a defense (regardless of who the D coach is and scheme).

Especially this first year of the transition...if we see a multitude of quick paced 3 and outs thatíll be a tall order for the defense to show a lot of improvement numbers wise. Iím all about the innovative offensive scheme no doubt Morris will bring...but common sense says if the fast paced run and gun isnít clicking thatíll be twice as hard on our defense because they will be on the field twice as long as should be.

Itís gonna be an interesting ride, thatís for sure. I look forward to guys who are faster and in better shape to last 4 full quarters.
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HogFoo

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #42 on: March 12, 2018, 09:13:40 am »

Agreed with this completely. Watching him in that weak 4 point stance all season was painful. As a whole, the d line was set up for failure last year.

To the OP, good thread with more specific info on Chavis. In laymanís terms Iíd say itís safe to say we will have a much more aggressive defensive look than we are used to. One thing we are not talking about in this thread is how is Morrisí offense going to compliment a defense (regardless of who the D coach is and scheme).

Especially this first year of the transition...if we see a multitude of quick paced 3 and outs thatíll be a tall order for the defense to show a lot of improvement numbers wise. Iím all about the innovative offensive scheme no doubt Morris will bring...but common sense says if the fast paced run and gun isnít clicking thatíll be twice as hard on our defense because they will be on the field twice as long as should be.

Itís gonna be an interesting ride, thatís for sure. I look forward to guys who are faster and in better shape to last 4 full quarters.
yes, i agree that , we hear about how the offense is gonna be Hammerdown.  But, what if it does take a little while before our defense catches on.  Will we be able to slow down our offense and be able to give the defense a break?  I think thats why we'll be in much better shape as a team than weve been since Petrino  was here. And i think we'll be in better shape than those years as well.    There is gonna definitely be an adjustment period along with growing pains. Itll be worth it tho.
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Hook 'em Hogs

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #43 on: March 12, 2018, 09:34:39 am »

This is truly one of Hogville's all-time-good threads that won't be remembered too long.  Good facts, some opposing views, but no namecalling.  Thanks to all that have and will contribute.  More of this, please!
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12247

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #44 on: March 12, 2018, 09:52:01 am »

You young fellers just don't understand.  CBs need to be able to poop on lightning and turn on a dime while giving you 8 cents change as opposed to Safties who need to be poop on lightning fast but can turn on a dime with the traditional 5 cents change.  The terminology has changed since the 60s and 70s.  But if got some of these, we gonna win some games
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12247

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #45 on: March 12, 2018, 10:07:29 am »

Great effort, conditioning, attention to details, a true group of second line players who know their job but may not be as good at it and true honest game management should help us win more games.
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bennyl08

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #46 on: March 12, 2018, 03:01:30 pm »

As I have said in an earlier post is that Agim had not been used by the previous coaching staff playing his strengths. I agree that Agim will be a terror for QB's.

While I agree with your statement, I don't think that was a major negative of the previous coaching staff. Go back to 2016 and they didn't play to his strengths by allowing him free reign to disrupt the backfield. However, they did that because they didn't trust the rest of the defense to cover for the inevitable lost gap control and the unset edge. In 2014, the staff felt comfortable in part because Flowers was experienced enough to be both disruptive and still maintain his assignments most the time. Something he didn't even begin to be able to do until he was a junior the previous year.

Fast forward to 2017 and I you'll see my post history called out the 3-4 many times talking about how most versions of the scheme don't let the DL players get penetration, by design. As in, you'd get in trouble with your DC if you did get into the backfield. There are some one-gap schemes that allow that, but clearly we didn't use those. However, while the 3-4 was decidedly worse for somebody like Agim in terms of not playing to his strengths, there's an entire defense to think about. We didn't have a lot of good DL players suited for a 4-3 defense. We play Agim's strengths and one of two things happen. Either we play some of our incredibly young DE's at the time who have a lot of pass rushing skill but were likely too young to handle the run game and just have teams run all over us and away from Agim, or use some of our bigger but slower DE's who could hold their own in the run game but would allow opposing offenses to simply double team Agim and thus making him ineffective anyways. The 3-4 was a very bad scheme change for Agim, but I do think it was the best move on paper for the team as a whole.
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twistitup

Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #47 on: March 12, 2018, 04:03:28 pm »

The 3-4 was a very bad scheme change for Agim, but I do think it was the best move on paper for the team as a whole.

Thanks for your input Benny Ben Ben, but Agim disagrees according to an article from last June:

With the defense switching to a 3-4 scheme, Agim feels it will allow him to play his game, and maybe reach the ceiling his high school coach sees for him.

"I feel like in the 4-3 I was just standing still," said Agim. "The 3-4 lets me move more, in my opinion."

More movement from Agim could result in more big plays as the Hog defense looks to create more havoc on opposing offenses.

http://www.arkansasmatters.com/sports/razorback-nation/im-far-from-perfect-agim-looking-to-build-on-solid-freshman-season/754256022
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #48 on: March 12, 2018, 05:51:25 pm »

Thanks for your input Benny Ben Ben, but Agim disagrees according to an article from last June:

With the defense switching to a 3-4 scheme, Agim feels it will allow him to play his game, and maybe reach the ceiling his high school coach sees for him.

"I feel like in the 4-3 I was just standing still," said Agim. "The 3-4 lets me move more, in my opinion."

More movement from Agim could result in more big plays as the Hog defense looks to create more havoc on opposing offenses.

http://www.arkansasmatters.com/sports/razorback-nation/im-far-from-perfect-agim-looking-to-build-on-solid-freshman-season/754256022

Let's face it, the 3-4 didn't work out as hoped for or expected.

In the Chavis version of the 4-3/4-2 the DE's are aligned in such a manner as to relieve them of having to deal with potential double-teams (according to the links to the articles provided). Additionally, this will be a defense more in tune with applying pressure, so if anything I expect that this particular scheme will provide an opportunity for Agim to showcase his quickness, speed and strength off the edge.

That said, we will see how it all works out. We are going to need DT's/Tilt NT's that are strong enough to command more/additional attention inside that relieves pressure from the DE's to free them up to come off the edge really hard and fast, forcing quicker decision making from those who attempt to run RPO's on us. But that is JMO.
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bennyl08

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Re: Explaining John Chavis' Defensive Philosophy
« Reply #49 on: March 12, 2018, 07:22:13 pm »

Thanks for your input Benny Ben Ben, but Agim disagrees according to an article from last June:

With the defense switching to a 3-4 scheme, Agim feels it will allow him to play his game, and maybe reach the ceiling his high school coach sees for him.

"I feel like in the 4-3 I was just standing still," said Agim. "The 3-4 lets me move more, in my opinion."

More movement from Agim could result in more big plays as the Hog defense looks to create more havoc on opposing offenses.

http://www.arkansasmatters.com/sports/razorback-nation/im-far-from-perfect-agim-looking-to-build-on-solid-freshman-season/754256022

Almost no player is every going to bad mouth their current coaches or team same way you're almost never going to hear a coach say that his players are crap.

https://www.seccountry.com/arkansas/arkansas-razorbacks-defense-mctelvin-agim

Twisty twist twist, Thanks for your input, but Agim disagrees according to an article from this past weak.

Arkansas defensive end McTelvin Agim didnít feel his full abilities were on display last season. In a 3-4 defensive scheme, he was often stuck taking on blocks and clogging running lanes rather than moving upfield to make plays himself.

ďI like being back on the edge again,Ē Agim said. ďI like the 4-3 because weíre actually going. In the 3-4 last year, we were mostly just sitting back a lot. Now, we can actually show our athletic ability.Ē

ďI feel like Iím going to be able to show my athletic ability more being able to lose that weight and being able to be back on the edge,Ē Agim said.

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