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Author Topic: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?  (Read 4751 times)

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urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #150 on: June 07, 2018, 12:59:01 pm »

You touched on something ignored in this B12 debate.  Had we stayed in the SWC and then been a part of the B12 (guessing at Baylor or TT's expense), we would have just kept our isolated recruiting base plus not acquired the resources we did to do the upgrades we have.  We wouldn't have been the program we've been however mediocre it has appeared.  May have won more games just due to the competition.  Wouldn't mean our teams were any better.  The coaching hire mistakes and mismanagement has hurt us more than anything.  Nutt over Tuberville.  Not "encouraging" Nutt to get on the plane in 03.  Allowing Broyles to stay so many years past when he should have retired.  White's meddling.  Had this happened with us in the B12, we would have endured the same rollercoaster we've been on.  Plus not be secure in our conference affiliation if Texas and/or OU decides to bolt.  We will always have fans obsessed with the state of Texas.  Been pleasantly surprised by Morris' recruiting not showing he and his staff are as obsessed.

It's ignored by some...but not everyone.  I had a family member who owned a very successful small business years ago.  They reached a point where they were comfortable with their income, work hours, and their lives in general.  When the bigger companies approached them, they didn't want to make the committment to supply them, because they were fearful of the repercussions that might ensue should they lose the bogger contracts that would then force them to cut staff, and be left with excess space and equipment.  They tried to stay where they were...content.   

They even turned down some substantial 7 figure buyout offers.  Lo and behold, after about a year or so, other competing companies who were willing to stick their necks out to ramp up production were able to sell much higher volumes, thereby reducing their margins to make the same net profit, and they just steamrolled them with their price advantage, and ability to supply much larger companies, much faster.  They went from highly valued, to done...in about 1.5 years.   

You CANNOT stay stagnant.  You're either growing, or you're declining.  That's just how business works, and make no mistake about it...NCAAF is a business.

Yes...if we pulled out about 15K seats, and dropped back to C-USA, we would win for a few years.  But...then it would even out, and we would still have to have a superior coach, and the best athletes for that conference to win.  We would NOT continue to get the SEC caliber athletes, and we certainly wouldn't stay in the 25-30 recruiting range that we've managed in the past several years, which most view as underachieving.  That would be a GREAT year of recruiting in the C-USA, or even the Big 12 for that matter.   
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Bubba's Bruisers

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #151 on: June 07, 2018, 12:59:53 pm »

When was the last time they got curb stomped by MSU? Last year MSu won in the waning seconds. 2 years ago the Hogs won at Starkville. 3 years ago MSU won 51-50, 4 years ago MSu, ranked #1, won by a td at Starkville, and the Hogs had a shot in the EZ at the end to tie that one.

Matter of FACT, the largest margin of victory for MSU was 45-14 in starkville in 2012. And MSu has only beaten the Hogs 8 times since the Hogs joined the SEC.

But that 1 loss in 1998 really stung me.

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urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #152 on: June 07, 2018, 01:12:00 pm »

I am convinced there are several on here who want to be in the Big 12 because they want to play Texas. They can not move past the swc days they grew up on, and would rather play Texas 12 times a year if they could, than be where the Hogs are. It is why every time the topic of ooc games comes up we get the same old " Lets play Texas every year " or " lets get a rotation of Texas, Baylor, SMU, Houston going " or my favorite " its got to be two Texas teams every year ".

I'm not going to look it up, but I have a feeling that if you took the complete time we've been in the SEC and compared our overall W-L record versus Bama, it wouldn't look much different than our W-L percentage versus TX all time.  ESPECIALLY if you throw out the wins we've gotten over them AFTER joining the SEC! 

That we've got to play TX teams is comical.  If we use that measuring stick, then TCU and TTU are on a level playing field with us based on recent history.  Pull out the wins over TX when they aren't anywhere near full strength, oh..and KSU, and we'd be mid pack there too.  It just doesn't add up to what some people perceive.

I just don't think it clicks with some people that we CANNOT succeed without a superior recruiter as our coach.  Call it "rah rah," or "used car salesman" or whatever people want to call it, we need someone with poise that commands respect at the helm, who can relate the the players and get them to the UA.  Period.  It does not sink in that the ENTIRE state of Arkansas produces about 6-7 DI caliber athletes PER YEAR, and odds are a few of them are going to want to get the heck out of dodge and go somewhere far away to play football. 

There are SCHOOLS in TX and LA, and Mississippi for that matter, who have that many. ONE...SCHOOL.  So, there is this perception of "woe is me" because of our small population, but at some point, the "woe is me" has to be acknowledged as a real hurdle that ANY coach at the UA has to overcome. 

Some...choose not to accept that, and think that somehow against all odds, we will recruit 25th and field a team that can not only compete in the SEC, but maybe win a NC.  No.  Just no.  It won't happen, so we need to win, jump in recruiting, win some more, and establish that we can win AND send kids to the NFL before FV being one of the top five cities in the US News and World Report to live in, amounts to a hill of beans.  It's not a popular sentiment, but it's the truth.  We have to get inside the top 15, keep everyone healthy, and at a minimum have some difference makers at QB, RB, and WR...and some studs on defense, to do what fans THINK we should be able to do.  Tall task, and who knows if CCM can do it, or what coach can?     
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hogsanity

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #153 on: June 07, 2018, 01:42:14 pm »

I'm not going to look it up, but I have a feeling that if you took the complete time we've been in the SEC and compared our overall W-L record versus Bama, it wouldn't look much different than our W-L percentage versus TX all time.  ESPECIALLY if you throw out the wins we've gotten over them AFTER joining the SEC! 

That we've got to play TX teams is comical.  If we use that measuring stick, then TCU and TTU are on a level playing field with us based on recent history.  Pull out the wins over TX when they aren't anywhere near full strength, oh..and KSU, and we'd be mid pack there too.  It just doesn't add up to what some people perceive.

I just don't think it clicks with some people that we CANNOT succeed without a superior recruiter as our coach.  Call it "rah rah," or "used car salesman" or whatever people want to call it, we need someone with poise that commands respect at the helm, who can relate the the players and get them to the UA.  Period.  It does not sink in that the ENTIRE state of Arkansas produces about 6-7 DI caliber athletes PER YEAR, and odds are a few of them are going to want to get the heck out of dodge and go somewhere far away to play football. 

There are SCHOOLS in TX and LA, and Mississippi for that matter, who have that many. ONE...SCHOOL.  So, there is this perception of "woe is me" because of our small population, but at some point, the "woe is me" has to be acknowledged as a real hurdle that ANY coach at the UA has to overcome. 

Some...choose not to accept that, and think that somehow against all odds, we will recruit 25th and field a team that can not only compete in the SEC, but maybe win a NC.  No.  Just no.  It won't happen, so we need to win, jump in recruiting, win some more, and establish that we can win AND send kids to the NFL before FV being one of the top five cities in the US News and World Report to live in, amounts to a hill of beans.  It's not a popular sentiment, but it's the truth.  We have to get inside the top 15, keep everyone healthy, and at a minimum have some difference makers at QB, RB, and WR...and some studs on defense, to do what fans THINK we should be able to do.  Tall task, and who knows if CCM can do it, or what coach can?     

Actually, if you only count conf games, Ark has a better win % over bama, 33% ( 8-16 ) (( and no I did not get into vacated games by Bama )) than over Texas 26% ( 19-54 ). And for all the talk, Hogs are only 3-2 over Tx since leaving the SWC. 
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k.c.hawg

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #154 on: June 07, 2018, 07:35:11 pm »

I personally wake up on game day wherever I might be, knowing Im going to or watching the best league in football next to the NFL. If [CENSORED] want to be in the SWC, Big  why not go ahead and go WAC or Sunbelt and letís go undefeated. When we were 10-2 lining up against OSU in the Sugar Bowl I donít recall any [CENSORED] asking this.

RyanMallettsEgo

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #155 on: June 07, 2018, 07:47:32 pm »

I personally wake up on game day wherever I might be, knowing Im going to or watching the best league in football next to the NFL. If [CENSORED] want to be in the SWC, Big  why not go ahead and go WAC or Sunbelt and letís go undefeated. When we were 10-2 lining up against OSU in the Sugar Bowl I donít recall any [CENSORED] asking this.

Ah yes, one instance from eight years ago makes such a strong case.

bythelake

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #156 on: June 07, 2018, 08:36:35 pm »

I personally wake up on game day wherever I might be, knowing Im going to or watching the best league in football next to the NFL. If [CENSORED] want to be in the SWC, Big  why not go ahead and go WAC or Sunbelt and letís go undefeated. When we were 10-2 lining up against OSU in the Sugar Bowl I donít recall any [CENSORED] asking this.

Now this is a post I personally enjoyed.  Thanks. 

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IronHog

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #157 on: June 07, 2018, 08:44:47 pm »

Actually, if you only count conf games, Ark has a better win % over bama, 33% ( 8-16 ) (( and no I did not get into vacated games by Bama )) than over Texas 26% ( 19-54 ). And for all the talk, Hogs are only 3-2 over Tx since leaving the SWC. 



Arkansas was cool when it was the anti-Texas


Now itís just Mizzouís thanksgiving win

HoginMemphis

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #158 on: June 07, 2018, 10:12:36 pm »



Arkansas was cool when it was the anti-Texas


Now itís just Mizzouís thanksgiving win
lol
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TNRazorbacker

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #159 on: June 07, 2018, 10:56:34 pm »

Nothing, but it was never about winning on the field. Not at all. Was purely a business decision and it was a good one. Not so good for us fans that would have more fun with more wins, but a much better cash cow for the University.
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Ben

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #160 on: June 08, 2018, 02:24:02 am »

Nothing at all. Don't let the program apologists fool you. No amount of excuses is going to change that. The only thing Arkansas has been able to do is chant "SEC", riding the coattails of the other top teams. Outside of that, the Hogs have a losing SEC record and 0 SEC titles. TCU was more successful as a midmajor for 16 years than Arkansas is as an SEC member for 26 years. Baylor has seen a BCS/NY6 bowl twice in the Big 12. Houston

The SEC was a money grab for the whole athletics program, but it really hasn't done much for the other sports either in regards to performance. Before the move, the Basketball team was still dominant with multiple final four appearances and Nolan was working upward, the baseball team had multiple NCAA/CWS series appearances including runner up in 79, and the track/cross country teams were still winning national titles.
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Pork Twain

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #161 on: June 08, 2018, 05:19:24 am »

How many times does the question need to be answered? 

If an algorithm can recognize faces, can’t one be developed that sends redundant OP’s directly to Trash?
Amen
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HoginMemphis

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #162 on: June 08, 2018, 09:31:04 am »

Nothing at all. Don't let the program apologists fool you. No amount of excuses is going to change that. The only thing Arkansas has been able to do is chant "SEC", riding the coattails of the other top teams. Outside of that, the Hogs have a losing SEC record and 0 SEC titles. TCU was more successful as a midmajor for 16 years than Arkansas is as an SEC member for 26 years. Baylor has seen a BCS/NY6 bowl twice in the Big 12. Houston

The SEC was a money grab for the whole athletics program, but it really hasn't done much for the other sports either in regards to performance. Before the move, the Basketball team was still dominant with multiple final four appearances and Nolan was working upward, the baseball team had multiple NCAA/CWS series appearances including runner up in 79, and the track/cross country teams were still winning national titles.
Per usual, follow the money. AD, coaches and chancellor making triple to quadruple what they were making just 15 or 20 years ago. JFB's last annual salary was no where near what Long made. Bielema making 4 times what Nutt and Ford made. Anyone else's income gone up 4 times in the last 15 years?  Fans have been left with ticket price increases averaging 6.5% per year for past 20 years, ever increasing RF contribution requirement to be able to buy tickets, worse parking on game day, and worst of all, terrible performance on the field. I bet the Hogs have a losing HOME conference record since joining the SEC. So, as always, follow the money. IN this case, it has led to nice facilities and wealthy coaches and administrators but has been worse for the team as far as winning games and pleasing fans at the games.
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ricepig

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #163 on: June 08, 2018, 11:16:17 am »

Per usual, follow the money. AD, coaches and chancellor making triple to quadruple what they were making just 15 or 20 years ago. JFB's last annual salary was no where near what Long made. Bielema making 4 times what Nutt and Ford made. Anyone else's income gone up 4 times in the last 15 years?  Fans have been left with ticket price increases averaging 6.5% per year for past 20 years, ever increasing RF contribution requirement to be able to buy tickets, worse parking on game day, and worst of all, terrible performance on the field. I bet the Hogs have a losing HOME conference record since joining the SEC. So, as always, follow the money. IN this case, it has led to nice facilities and wealthy coaches and administrators but has been worse for the team as far as winning games and pleasing fans at the games.

Would it surprise you that the RF has paid Broyles around $4M the past 5 years or so? As to the fans, they still seem to be buying tickets and making contributions, I guess something pleases them enough to continue to do so.
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hogsanity

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #164 on: June 08, 2018, 11:56:39 am »

Would it surprise you that the RF has paid Broyles around $4M the past 5 years or so? As to the fans, they still seem to be buying tickets and making contributions, I guess something pleases them enough to continue to do so.

Habit, ego, need to see and be seen, enjoying the whole game day/tailgating thing, wanting to see teams like Bama/Aub/FLA when they come to play the Hogs, the hope the Hogs might pull and upset, or win if they are favored. There are many many reasons people might be buying tickets that have very little to do with what actually transpires on the field.
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ricepig

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #165 on: June 08, 2018, 12:41:52 pm »

Habit, ego, need to see and be seen, enjoying the whole game day/tailgating thing, wanting to see teams like Bama/Aub/FLA when they come to play the Hogs, the hope the Hogs might pull and upset, or win if they are favored. There are many many reasons people might be buying tickets that have very little to do with what actually transpires on the field.

Or some are fans of the Razorbacks and enjoy watching them play.

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #166 on: June 08, 2018, 01:18:59 pm »

I personally wake up on game day wherever I might be, knowing Im going to or watching the best league in football next to the NFL. If [CENSORED] want to be in the SWC, Big  why not go ahead and go WAC or Sunbelt and letís go undefeated. When we were 10-2 lining up against OSU in the Sugar Bowl I donít recall any [CENSORED] asking this.

This is what im talking about. Wanting to dickride the success and reputation of other SEC teams to compensate for the consistent lack of success from your own team. That's lame. Sure when we went 10-2 those 2 seasons out of 26 seasons, stuff like this wasn't asked. But when arkansas was dominant in the SWC, there was no sense of Conference Pride like it is now either. It was all about beating Texas and reaching a major bowl game, something Arkansas has done once as an SEC member.

Its also apples and oranges to suggest Arkansas move to the WAC or sun belt to win. Those conferences are midmajors who will never have title hopes. Meanwhile in the Big 12, every team in the past 20 years minus Iowa State has either been in position to go to the national title game, or have played in a BCS/NY6 bowl.

hogsanity

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #167 on: June 08, 2018, 01:42:12 pm »

Or some are fans of the Razorbacks and enjoy watching them play.

Exactly, and that, just like the other reasons I listed and probably another 100 too, has nothing to do with "competing" or "success" in the sec, because there has been precious little of that. So the move to the SEc was about money, and it has worked beautifully.
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Adam Stokes

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #168 on: June 08, 2018, 01:54:42 pm »

I personally wake up on game day wherever I might be, knowing Im going to or watching the best league in football next to the NFL. If [CENSORED] want to be in the SWC, Big  why not go ahead and go WAC or Sunbelt and let’s go undefeated. When we were 10-2 lining up against OSU in the Sugar Bowl I don’t recall any [CENSORED] asking this.

That one whole BCS year was great, but it's the only one we've been to in the 20 years the BCS/CFP has existed. Had we been in the Big 12 we easily would've had greater opportunities to play in those big games. Want to see the other company that has also been to one whole BCS game?

From 98' to 13':

Baylor
Colorado
Connecticut
Georgia Tech
Hawaii
Kansas
Maryland
Michigan State
Northern Illinois
Oklahoma State
Oregon State
Pittsburgh
Purdue
Syracuse
Texas A&M
UCF
UCLA
Wake Forest
Washington
Washington State

The only teams on our level prestige-wise on that whole list is Colorado, UCLA, A&M, and Washington (who would be even higher now with their appearances in the CFP.) Our postseason accolades are now on par with Hawaii and NIU. Woot woot.

And shoot, we have less appearances than Illinois, Cincy, Kansas State, TCU, Boise State, and Utah. All teams we should be performing better than.

We could be in the Big 12 and have greater wins, greater prestige, greater playoff potential (and greater basketball) than staying in the SEC will ever get us. But hey, nothing like competing with the best right? If you all want to hoot and holler like Nutt for earning a SECW ring every decade be my guest.

RyanMallettsEgo

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #169 on: June 08, 2018, 01:58:07 pm »

That one whole BCS year was great, but it's the only one we've been to in the 20 years the BCS/CFP has existed. Had we been in the Big 12 we easily would've had greater opportunities to play in those big games. Want to see the other company that has also been to one whole BCS game?

From 98' to 13':

Baylor
Colorado
Connecticut
Georgia Tech
Hawaii
Kansas
Maryland
Michigan State
Northern Illinois
Oklahoma State
Oregon State
Pittsburgh
Purdue
Syracuse
Texas A&M
UCF
UCLA
Wake Forest
Washington
Washington State

The only teams on our level prestige wise on that whole list is UCLA, A&M, and Washington (who is now higher with their appearances in the CFP.) Our postseason accolades are now on par with Hawaii. Woot woot.

And shoot, we have less appearances than Illinois, Cincy and Kansas State, TCU, Boise State, and Utah.

We could be in the Big 12 and have greater wins, greater prestige, and greater playoff potential than staying in the SEC will ever get us. But hey, nothing like competing with the best right? If you all want to hoot and holler like Nutt for earning a SECW ring every decade be my guest.

This is good.
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hogsanity

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #170 on: June 08, 2018, 02:00:03 pm »

That one whole BCS year was great, but it's the only one we've been to in the 20 years the BCS/CFP has existed. Had we been in the Big 12 we easily would've had greater opportunities to play in those big games. Want to see the other company that has also been to one whole BCS game?

From 98' to 13':

Baylor
Colorado
Connecticut
Georgia Tech
Hawaii
Kansas
Maryland
Michigan State
Northern Illinois
Oklahoma State
Oregon State
Pittsburgh
Purdue
Syracuse
Texas A&M
UCF
UCLA
Wake Forest
Washington
Washington State

The only teams on our level prestige-wise on that whole list is Colorado, UCLA, A&M, and Washington (who would be even higher now with their appearances in the CFP.) Our postseason accolades are now on par with Hawaii and NIU. Woot woot.

And shoot, we have less appearances than Illinois, Cincy and Kansas State, TCU, Boise State, and Utah.

We could be in the Big 12 and have greater wins, greater prestige, and greater playoff potential than staying in the SEC will ever get us. But hey, nothing like competing with the best right? If you all want to hoot and holler like Nutt for earning a SECW ring every decade be my guest.

But you are just assuming the Hogs would have done those things. No way to KNOW they would have been to more bcs games. No way to KNOW they would have won big12 titles.
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RyanMallettsEgo

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #171 on: June 08, 2018, 02:02:05 pm »

But you are just assuming the Hogs would have done those things. No way to KNOW they would have been to more bcs games. No way to KNOW they would have won big12 titles.

Based on historical records against teams in the Big 12 vs. SEC, you can make an assumption that we would have done/be doing better.

Yes, it's an assumption. But that's what an assumption is.

I had a post one time that laid out a bunch of different records broken down, but of course, that thread got deleted, not just trashed.

That data showed considerably favorable records against current Big 12 teams that were in the SWC. Yes, times and things change. But based on history, it's safe to assume we'd be doing better.
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hogsanity

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #172 on: June 08, 2018, 02:10:18 pm »

Based on historical records against teams in the Big 12 vs. SEC, you can make an assumption that we would have done/be doing better.

Yes, it's an assumption. But that's what an assumption is.

I had a post one time that laid out a bunch of different records broken down, but of course, that thread got deleted, not just trashed.

That data showed considerably favorable records against current Big 12 teams that were in the SWC. Yes, times and things change. But based on history, it's safe to assume we'd be doing better.


Oh I think instead of a 7-8 win program, they might be a 8-9 win program, but I doubt it. Still small recruiting base, PLUS in the BIG12 you are even farther removed from likely getting much out of the SE US, so now you are right back to fighting your conferences foes for the same recruits. 
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HoginMemphis

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #173 on: June 08, 2018, 02:28:40 pm »

Would it surprise you that the RF has paid Broyles around $4M the past 5 years or so? As to the fans, they still seem to be buying tickets and making contributions, I guess something pleases them enough to continue to do so.
Yes, very surprising that he was paid that much. Must have had a contract back end loaded given that he was doing nothing but occasional fund raising. Or was just a big "thank you".

Not surprising that fans are still buying tickets. Firstly, it's mostly corporate. That may change given the new tax law. I know it has affected some of my friends whose companies buy season tickets. They have reduced RF contribution and cut # of tickets they buy for a season.

 Secondly, fans are very susceptible to the old, "next year is the year" and the fomo syndrome. Bad for them and great for the U of A.
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HoginMemphis

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #174 on: June 08, 2018, 02:31:55 pm »

Exactly, and that, just like the other reasons I listed and probably another 100 too, has nothing to do with "competing" or "success" in the sec, because there has been precious little of that. So the move to the SEc was about money, and it has worked beautifully.
I am one of those rare people who thinks it is a colossal waste of both my time and money if the team isn't good. I would rather be reading a book or on a trip or at the lake or at Telluride. I dropped season tickets fast in 2002 after I had seen enough of Nutt. Have not had them since and cannot imagine ever having them again as long as we are in the SEC. I am 56 and I hope we have another 9 win season before I move on to the next life. But if we do, I will not have season tickets to it.
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HoginMemphis

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #175 on: June 08, 2018, 02:33:19 pm »

That one whole BCS year was great, but it's the only one we've been to in the 20 years the BCS/CFP has existed. Had we been in the Big 12 we easily would've had greater opportunities to play in those big games. Want to see the other company that has also been to one whole BCS game?

From 98' to 13':

Baylor
Colorado
Connecticut
Georgia Tech
Hawaii
Kansas
Maryland
Michigan State
Northern Illinois
Oklahoma State
Oregon State
Pittsburgh
Purdue
Syracuse
Texas A&M
UCF
UCLA
Wake Forest
Washington
Washington State

The only teams on our level prestige-wise on that whole list is Colorado, UCLA, A&M, and Washington (who would be even higher now with their appearances in the CFP.) Our postseason accolades are now on par with Hawaii and NIU. Woot woot.

And shoot, we have less appearances than Illinois, Cincy, Kansas State, TCU, Boise State, and Utah. All teams we should be performing better than.

We could be in the Big 12 and have greater wins, greater prestige, greater playoff potential (and greater basketball) than staying in the SEC will ever get us. But hey, nothing like competing with the best right? If you all want to hoot and holler like Nutt for earning a SECW ring every decade be my guest.
But we are rich and play the best every week. Oh, and we are Vandy and Ky.
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hogsanity

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #176 on: June 08, 2018, 02:47:52 pm »

I am one of those rare people who thinks it is a colossal waste of both my time and money if the team isn't good. I would rather be reading a book or on a trip or at the lake or at Telluride. I dropped season tickets fast in 2002 after I had seen enough of Nutt. Have not had them since and cannot imagine ever having them again as long as we are in the SEC. I am 56 and I hope we have another 9 win season before I move on to the next life. But if we do, I will not have season tickets to it.

I think season tickets are a colossal waste of money, period. Neither I nor anyone I know has had trouble getting tickets to any game, except Bama in 2010, USC in 06 and apparently TX in 69, but I was still 2 months from being born then.
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ricepig

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #177 on: June 08, 2018, 02:59:31 pm »

That one whole BCS year was great, but it's the only one we've been to in the 20 years the BCS/CFP has existed. Had we been in the Big 12 we easily would've had greater opportunities to play in those big games. Want to see the other company that has also been to one whole BCS game?

From 98' to 13':

Baylor
Colorado
Connecticut
Georgia Tech
Hawaii
Kansas
Maryland
Michigan State
Northern Illinois
Oklahoma State
Oregon State
Pittsburgh
Purdue
Syracuse
Texas A&M
UCF
UCLA
Wake Forest
Washington
Washington State

The only teams on our level prestige-wise on that whole list is Colorado, UCLA, A&M, and Washington (who would be even higher now with their appearances in the CFP.) Our postseason accolades are now on par with Hawaii and NIU. Woot woot.

And shoot, we have less appearances than Illinois, Cincy, Kansas State, TCU, Boise State, and Utah. All teams we should be performing better than.

We could be in the Big 12 and have greater wins, greater prestige, greater playoff potential (and greater basketball) than staying in the SEC will ever get us. But hey, nothing like competing with the best right? If you all want to hoot and holler like Nutt for earning a SECW ring every decade be my guest.

Or, we could be in the Big 12 and be in the same position as currently are, correct? There's no guarantee that we would have had more success than we previously have had, just speculation of it.
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oldhawg

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #178 on: June 08, 2018, 03:14:27 pm »


We could be in the Big 12 and have greater wins, greater prestige, greater playoff potential (and greater basketball) than staying in the SEC will ever get us. But hey, nothing like competing with the best right? If you all want to hoot and holler like Nutt for earning a SECW ring every decade be my guest.
 

Why are some people so convinced that Arkansas would have a much better record in the Big 12 as opposed to the SEC?

In six seasons in the SEC, Texas A&M has posted a 51-23 record.  In the six seasons previous to joining the SEC, the Aggies were 42-35 in the Big Twelve.  And the Aggies have owned the Razorbacks since moving to the SEC.

There is very little reason to believe that a Bielema coached team would perform any better in the Big 12 than it did in the SEC.

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IronHog

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #179 on: June 08, 2018, 03:38:50 pm »

Nothing, but it was never about winning on the field. Not at all. Was purely a business decision and it was a good one. Not so good for us fans that would have more fun with more wins, but a much better cash cow for the University.



Thereís that dang university getting in the way again


If you handed UCA the Razorback foundation theyíd be a SEC West threat in 5 years....
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IronHog

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #180 on: June 08, 2018, 03:40:41 pm »

Why are some people so convinced that Arkansas would have a much better record in the Big 12 as opposed to the SEC?

In six seasons in the SEC, Texas A&M has posted a 51-23 record.  In the six seasons previous to joining the SEC, the Aggies were 42-35 in the Big Twelve.  And the Aggies have owned the Razorbacks since moving to the SEC.

There is very little reason to believe that a Bielema coached team would perform any better in the Big 12 than it did in the SEC.




Mizzou and aTm look better then they really are because they get to play Arkansas in the SEC.


Wait what?
« Last Edit: June 08, 2018, 03:54:10 pm by IronHog »
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Adam Stokes

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #181 on: June 08, 2018, 03:52:55 pm »

Why are some people so convinced that Arkansas would have a much better record in the Big 12 as opposed to the SEC?

In six seasons in the SEC, Texas A&M has posted a 51-23 record.  In the six seasons previous to joining the SEC, the Aggies were 42-35 in the Big Twelve.  And the Aggies have owned the Razorbacks since moving to the SEC.

There is very little reason to believe that a Bielema coached team would perform any better in the Big 12 than it did in the SEC.



Well, let's use BB as an example. We played 6 games against Big 12 teams while Bret was head coach, and we went 4-2 (67%) against them. All were bowl eligible teams in the years we played them.

Bret went 11-29 (28%) against SEC teams while head coach, some of which weren't bowl eligible. Į\_(ツ)_/Į

So while we can never really know, I'm still pretty convinced.

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HogPharmer

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #182 on: June 08, 2018, 04:07:38 pm »



Thereís that dang university getting in the way again


If you handed UCA the Razorback foundation theyíd be a SEC West threat in 5 years....

That's only because Norvell coached there for a little while....
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hogsanity

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #183 on: June 08, 2018, 04:08:33 pm »

Well, let's use BB as an example. We played 6 games against Big 12 teams while Bret was head coach, and we went 4-2 (67%) against them. All were bowl eligible teams in the years we played them.

Bret went 11-29 (28%) against SEC teams while head coach, some of which weren't bowl eligible. Į\_(ツ)_/Į

So while we can never really know, I'm still pretty convinced.



Which big12 teams did they play? They got TT twice, TCU twice, Texas once and KSu once. In the season where they Hogs won, TT went 4-8. TCU went 6-7. Texas went 6-7. KSu went 6-7. So of the 4 wins you mentioned against big12 teams, none ended the season with a winning record, and were a combined 22-29.

IT's not like the Hogs went 4-2 against the top of the big12. 
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HogPharmer

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #184 on: June 08, 2018, 04:10:11 pm »

Which big12 teams did they play? They got TT twice, TCU twice, Texas once and KSu once. In the season where they Hogs won, TT went 4-8. TCU went 6-7. Texas went 6-7. KSu went 6-7. So of the 4 wins you mentioned against big12 teams, none ended the season with a winning record, and were a combined 22-29.

IT's not like the Hogs went 4-2 against the top of the big12.

Don't destroy his narrative....
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WilsonHog

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #185 on: June 08, 2018, 04:18:03 pm »

I do not know if we would experience success in the Big XII.

I do know that we havenít in the SEC, as evidenced by our won loss record (91-116-2) over the last 26 years. We would have to experience the greatest run of success in the history of our football program over the next three years just to reach .500 after almost 30 years in the conference.

One is speculation, the other fact.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2018, 04:31:23 pm by WilsonHog »
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HoginMemphis

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #186 on: June 08, 2018, 04:29:01 pm »

I think season tickets are a colossal waste of money, period. Neither I nor anyone I know has had trouble getting tickets to any game, except Bama in 2010, USC in 06 and apparently TX in 69, but I was still 2 months from being born then.
People will disagree becausae it is what they like to do with their time and money. Some like to go to Vegas or Tunica and gamble. I would tell you that is a colossal waster of time and money. They would disagree. I spend money on country club and lately, skeet tournaments and shotguns. But that is me spending money on me...not on a bunch of college age kids and multi millionaire coaches.
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urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #187 on: June 08, 2018, 04:37:48 pm »

I am one of those rare people who thinks it is a colossal waste of both my time and money if the team isn't good. I would rather be reading a book or on a trip or at the lake or at Telluride. I dropped season tickets fast in 2002 after I had seen enough of Nutt. Have not had them since and cannot imagine ever having them again as long as we are in the SEC. I am 56 and I hope we have another 9 win season before I move on to the next life. But if we do, I will not have season tickets to it.

And I for one, am glad you don't.  If you love a winner, why don't you root for Bama?  Isn't that easier than having to endure the undying pain of watching the Razorback program never meet your expectations?  You aren't man enough to remain a fan and support the product, so why not take the easy way out and just root for a team that meets your expectations?  Maybe Clemson? 

urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #188 on: June 08, 2018, 04:41:24 pm »

Why are some people so convinced that Arkansas would have a much better record in the Big 12 as opposed to the SEC?

In six seasons in the SEC, Texas A&M has posted a 51-23 record.  In the six seasons previous to joining the SEC, the Aggies were 42-35 in the Big Twelve.  And the Aggies have owned the Razorbacks since moving to the SEC.

There is very little reason to believe that a Bielema coached team would perform any better in the Big 12 than it did in the SEC.

Well, because some people want to pull historical SWC and Big 12 records versus the SEC and extrapolate things that aren't real world.  We have SEC athletes on our team.  Move us out of the SEC, and we don't.  It's that simple.  We LOSE that advantage, and that's what some people fail to acknowledge. 

I don't need to extrapolate much.  We were 1-1 versus both TTech and TCU.  They are NOT the powers of the Big 12, and that's what I'm going by.  Add that to us pitching almost a reverse shutout versus TAMU in the SEC, and it's pretty easy for me to suggest that maybe we wouldn't be walking over everyone in the Big 12.   
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WilsonHog

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #189 on: June 08, 2018, 04:44:29 pm »

I have had season football tickets for over 30 years, and season baseball tickets for the last two. If my wife and I move to Fayetteville in a couple of years, I plan to buy season basketball tickets.

Itís just what I enjoy doing. My wife and I probably spend a dozen weekends a year in Fayetteville now, watching whatever Razorback sport is in season. If we ever do move up there, the only games Iíll miss will likely be those Iím not in town for.

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #190 on: June 08, 2018, 07:12:55 pm »

Or, we could be in the Big 12 and be in the same position as currently are, correct? There's no guarantee that we would have had more success than we previously have had, just speculation of it.

I would venture a guess that many of the really good players we have had over the years that came from east of the Mississippi river would have gone elsewhere had we not been in the SEC.

I will also say that Hatfield was an excellent coach but in a conference where at the time all you had to do was beat Texas and what ever other team was hot at the time to make it to the Cotton Bowl, we only went twice in six years.
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bythelake

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #191 on: June 08, 2018, 07:21:00 pm »

This is what im talking about. Wanting to dickride the success and reputation of other SEC teams to compensate for the consistent lack of success from your own team. That's lame. Sure when we went 10-2 those 2 seasons out of 26 seasons, stuff like this wasn't asked. But when arkansas was dominant in the SWC, there was no sense of Conference Pride like it is now either. It was all about beating Texas and reaching a major bowl game, something Arkansas has done once as an SEC member.

Its also apples and oranges to suggest Arkansas move to the WAC or sun belt to win. Those conferences are midmajors who will never have title hopes. Meanwhile in the Big 12, every team in the past 20 years minus Iowa State has either been in position to go to the national title game, or have played in a BCS/NY6 bowl.

Let me get this for the record Ben,  do yo want Arkansas to leave the SEC for the Big 12?  Yes or no please.  Iíve seen enough of your diatribes.
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HoginMemphis

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #192 on: June 09, 2018, 12:05:35 am »

And I for one, am glad you don't.  If you love a winner, why don't you root for Bama?  Isn't that easier than having to endure the undying pain of watching the Razorback program never meet your expectations?  You aren't man enough to remain a fan and support the product, so why not take the easy way out and just root for a team that meets your expectations?  Maybe Clemson?
I am not man enough to remain a fan. That made me laugh out loud.  Hilarious stuff and people you find here. You folks need psychiatric help.
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IronHog

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #193 on: June 09, 2018, 01:24:11 am »

Well, because some people want to pull historical SWC and Big 12 records versus the SEC and extrapolate things that aren't real world.  We have SEC athletes on our team.  Move us out of the SEC, and we don't.  It's that simple.  We LOSE that advantage, and that's what some people fail to acknowledge. 

I don't need to extrapolate much.  We were 1-1 versus both TTech and TCU.  They are NOT the powers of the Big 12, and that's what I'm going by.  Add that to us pitching almost a reverse shutout versus TAMU in the SEC, and it's pretty easy for me to suggest that maybe we wouldn't be walking over everyone in the Big 12.   


Itís all about Texas


Yíall just donít get it.  Never will.


Have fun being Mizzous doormat
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jkstock04

Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #194 on: June 09, 2018, 02:16:13 am »

Well, because some people want to pull historical SWC and Big 12 records versus the SEC and extrapolate things that aren't real world.  We have SEC athletes on our team.  Move us out of the SEC, and we don't.  It's that simple.  We LOSE that advantage, and that's what some people fail to acknowledge. 

I don't need to extrapolate much.  We were 1-1 versus both TTech and TCU.  They are NOT the powers of the Big 12, and that's what I'm going by.  Add that to us pitching almost a reverse shutout versus TAMU in the SEC, and it's pretty easy for me to suggest that maybe we wouldn't be walking over everyone in the Big 12.   
All kinds of holes in this post...we have SEC athletes now so we are supposedly better than being in the big 12. Yet as you say we are only .500 against a couple of lower/mid tier so that proves we wouldn't be successful in the big 12. But what about the SEC athletes? Shouldn't that trump anything big 12? LOL. Coastal Carolina game last year was oozing with SEC talent for sure /s.

Ok state is 2ish hours from our campus, a complete cow town, and wins 10 games per year and in the top 20 pretty much year in and year out. You SEC SEC homers can never spin that one away.
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urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #195 on: June 09, 2018, 02:27:30 pm »

All kinds of holes in this post...we have SEC athletes now so we are supposedly better than being in the big 12. Yet as you say we are only .500 against a couple of lower/mid tier so that proves we wouldn't be successful in the big 12. But what about the SEC athletes? Shouldn't that trump anything big 12? LOL. Coastal Carolina game last year was oozing with SEC talent for sure /s.

Ok state is 2ish hours from our campus, a complete cow town, and wins 10 games per year and in the top 20 pretty much year in and year out. You SEC SEC homers can never spin that one away.

Holes?  Really?  I have said all along that we haven't fielded a team that would do anything CLOSE to dominating the Big 12, MUCH LESS the SEC.  What part of that are you HiM and Ironhog struggling with? 

The HOLE is that you guys think leaving the SEC would solve all of our woes.  That as absolute ASSUMPTION, and nothing more.  We couldn't even sweep TCU and TTech, and they weren't even having good seasons when we lost to them. 

You guys kills me.  You act like it's the SEC's fault that we suck.  COMEDY at its best.  We suck, because we haven't been able to win at a high enough clip to get kids to want to come play football here.  Is that because our coaches aren't targeting the right places, aren't good enough recruiters, or the result of our inherent disadvantage of being a small state with limited D1 talent?  Who knows at this point. 

But...I continue to marvel at those who think taking an EASIER path is the answer.  Again, we either step it up and find a way to compete in football, or we continue as a doormat like KY and Vandy, historically.  IT DOES NOT change that we are competitive in virtually every other sport, and we're NOT going to leave the SEC and give that up.  I guess if it got to the point that the football stadium was barely half full, then they might have to look at options to fund everything, but until then...quit being pansies and whining about having to play a difficult schedule.  It's a loser's mentality.   
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urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #196 on: June 09, 2018, 02:34:41 pm »

All kinds of holes in this post...we have SEC athletes now so we are supposedly better than being in the big 12. Yet as you say we are only .500 against a couple of lower/mid tier so that proves we wouldn't be successful in the big 12. But what about the SEC athletes? Shouldn't that trump anything big 12? LOL. Coastal Carolina game last year was oozing with SEC talent for sure /s.

Ok state is 2ish hours from our campus, a complete cow town, and wins 10 games per year and in the top 20 pretty much year in and year out. You SEC SEC homers can never spin that one away.

So your argument against the SEC is OSU wins 8-10 games a year?  Wow...you dug for that.  We couldn't have beaten North Dakota State, who's not even D1, the past few seasons.  Which begs the questions...is that coaching, or is it inherent challenges we face?  Maybe CM will expose that, and maybe he won't, and we'll have to go to the well again.  It doesn't change ANYTHING with regard to the SEC and our membership there. 

All four of you literally just ran down the program, but profess to be great fans.  Wow...who needs opponents with attitudes like that?  You act like there's no hope that we can ever do anything, but as we saw in 2010 and 2011, with a good coach and some solid players, we can compete.  I know, I know..."Oooh, 2 seasons."  Well...it took awhile to build it to that, and CBB wasn't able to duplicate it during his time, so those aren't the best measuring sticks.  We'll see what happens if we have a coach that can keep it in his pants, recruit TX, and seemingly take things a little more seriously than windbreaker.  Until then....all this posturing about how the SEC is ruining our program is funny when you see all the new stadium additions, practice facilities, and how we DO compete in most every other sport. 

It's FAR from the gloom and doom you guys subscribe to.   :puke:
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RyanMallettsEgo

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #197 on: June 09, 2018, 02:35:12 pm »

Holes?  Really?  I have said all along that we haven't fielded a team that would do anything CLOSE to dominating the Big 12, MUCH LESS the SEC.  What part of that are you HiM and Ironhog struggling with? 

The HOLE is that you guys think leaving the SEC would solve all of our woes.  That as absolute ASSUMPTION, and nothing more.  We couldn't even sweep TCU and TTech, and they weren't even having good seasons when we lost to them. 

You guys kills me.  You act like it's the SEC's fault that we suck.  COMEDY at its best.  We suck, because we haven't been able to win at a high enough clip to get kids to want to come play football here.  Is that because our coaches aren't targeting the right places, aren't good enough recruiters, or the result of our inherent disadvantage of being a small state with limited D1 talent?  Who knows at this point. 

But...I continue to marvel at those who think taking an EASIER path is the answer.  Again, we either step it up and find a way to compete in football, or we continue as a doormat like KY and Vandy, historically.  IT DOES NOT change that we are competitive in virtually every other sport, and we're NOT going to leave the SEC and give that up.  I guess if it got to the point that the football stadium was barely half full, then they might have to look at options to fund everything, but until then...quit being pansies and whining about having to play a difficult schedule.  It's a loser's mentality.   

Classic.

"We just gotta try harder!"
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urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #198 on: June 09, 2018, 02:35:48 pm »

But....it starts with RECRUITING.  Until we move up with that, we won't beat top Big 12 or SEC teams. 
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urkillnmesmalls

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Re: What good has money from the SEC done for the Hogs on the field?
« Reply #199 on: June 09, 2018, 02:38:08 pm »

Classic.

"We just gotta try harder!"

Yep.  That's it.  Our coaches have to do a better job of finding places where they can pull the best players, and our players have to play with more passion, and our coaches have to make better in game decisions, and we can't give away games in the 4th quarter. 

Do you disagree that we GAVE AWAY multiple games over the past two seasons simply by not being able to compete in the 4th quarter? 

Does a move away from the SEC solve that?  I REFUSE to go back throug this craptastic argument with you specifically again.  You have a LOSER's mentaity, and nothing is going to change that.  Let's just skip the particulars and drop back to D2 so we can beat everyone.  It's embarrassing to see you guys carry on like that. 
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