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Author Topic: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?  (Read 3187 times)

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checkraiser88

Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« on: May 22, 2018, 07:52:39 pm »

BB was horrible at critical situations at the end of games and with timeouts in general. It hurt us big time in a few of those A&M games. I am hoping CM will bring actual intelligence back to the field in key moments.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2018, 08:11:44 pm by checkraiser88 »
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MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2018, 08:05:38 pm »

BB was horrible at critical situations at the end of games and with timeouts in general. It hurt us big time in a few of those A&M games. Was hoping CM would bring actual intelligence back to the field in key moments.

Have you studied it? What are you bringing to the table for conversation with regard to Coach Morris and his on-field, in-game intelligence with regard to key play calls? I'd like to see a break down of plays at key moments as well. It takes a lot of research.
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checkraiser88

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2018, 08:11:13 pm »

Have you studied it? What are you bringing to the table for conversation with regard to Coach Morris?

This was not a negative post, just seeing if anyone has studied his in game management in depth. I'll edit, mistyped
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Boardon Hamsay

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2018, 08:13:48 pm »

BB was horrible at critical situations at the end of games and with timeouts in general. It hurt us big time in a few of those A&M games. I am hoping CM will bring actual intelligence back to the field in key moments.

I am waiting to hear back from the guys over at Lambda Lambda Lambda. The nerd situation is fluid....

MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2018, 08:25:35 pm »

This was not a negative post, just seeing if anyone has studied his in game management in depth. I'll edit, mistyped

I'm just saying, we "stats nerds" like to discuss, but it is good if you bring something to the table. I apologize, I don't mean to be negative. I know I (and others) spend a lot of time looking at these types of things and it involves a lot of work on our part. Just like to see folks "involved" in the research and discussion. It tends to bring out the best in threads when we are discussing actual results instead of opinions.

Of course the other side of the argument is, what Morris did when in full control as a HC at SMU and the talent level that he had available to him at the time vs. the competition he faced, and how do you relate that to what he did at Clemson as a OC when he had greater talent levels available to him, but not full control of what was to be done on offense (HC overview) against greater levels of competition? Lots of variables involved here.

Bottom line, we will go faster and we will attempt to scheme so as to take advantage of throwing the opposing defense off balance.

Honestly, I am not worried about the offense, though it may take time to matriculate and execute it as designed. I'm more concerned about what "Chief" is able to do with the defense and I think that will be a larger contributing factor to our level of success in 2018. If the defense is above average, we will win more games than we project in 2018.
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OneTuskOverTheLine™

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2018, 10:10:29 pm »

I am waiting to hear back from the guys over at Lambda Lambda Lambda. The nerd situation is fluid....
Gonna be a minute; they are PI spying at the moment...
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Mike_e

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2018, 04:04:55 pm »

He's a math guy so he'll probably play the odds/pay attention to detail and so forth.

He also is likely to have a passing understanding of game theory.  Not a pun, look it up.  ;)

Pig in the Pokey

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #7 on: May 27, 2018, 04:30:11 pm »

He is going to seem like a genius after 3 of our last 4 coaches being notoriously bad at in game management. Nutt, Bozo, and Fatty were all awful.

Hou-Hog

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #8 on: May 27, 2018, 06:00:22 pm »

The title of this thread is ridiculous. I love people that are helpless but use a negative connotation to describe those that can do what they cannot.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2018, 12:55:21 am by Hou-Hog »
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Sed76

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #9 on: May 27, 2018, 06:07:55 pm »

When something bad happens I hope he shows some emotion instead of just standing there with the blank stare we have seen the past 5 years.

theFlyingHog

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #10 on: May 27, 2018, 06:25:58 pm »

The title of this thread is ridiculous. I love people that are helpless but use a negative connotation for discribe those that can do what they cannot.
Wut’s Discribe?
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Ex-Trumpet

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2018, 07:24:22 pm »

The title of this thread is ridiculous. I love people that are helpless but use a negative connotation for discribe those that can do what they cannot.

Usually ridiculous is the word folks can't spell.
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Bacons Rebellion

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2018, 07:44:06 pm »

He means "end game management," right?
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GoHogs1091

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2018, 10:56:42 pm »

Coach Morris' in-game management should be a lot better than Bielema's.

Bielema's in-game management was atrocious.

LRrazorback

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2018, 11:06:55 pm »

Very good topic.

I haven't done the research to be able to discuss numbers but, I don't think we'll be complaining about in game decisions CCM makes like we have with CBB.  In contrast, I don't ever recall complaining personally or reading a complaint on this site about an in game decision CBP made.
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Porkys Revenge

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #15 on: May 28, 2018, 01:42:45 pm »

I’d just like him to have some fire on the sideline. Haven’t seen that since BP edited.
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Superhog1959

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #16 on: May 28, 2018, 02:09:07 pm »

I have two comments here.
First, the term nerd to me, refers to someone intelligent that does research beyond what most people do. So I would not take someone calling me a nerd as a insult.
Second, Bret didn't seem to make in game adjustments well, if at all in some games. That is at least a good part of the reason, we would be ahead at halftime only to lose the games in the 4th.
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DeltaBoy

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2018, 09:20:58 am »

I expect we play faster, he will be like Bobby P and make brillant calls at key points of the game.

HF#1

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #18 on: May 29, 2018, 11:46:11 am »

I can tell you this, he is going to run shotgun inside the 5 yard line.
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Rudy Baylor

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Rudy Baylor

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jkstock04

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #21 on: May 29, 2018, 01:17:08 pm »

I'm gonna take a wild stab at this and say there isn't much evidence either way on this one. With his SMU stint what games are you going to refer to where they won a nail biter big game off coaching decisions? Or vice versa lost a big game in the final moments off a coaching decision?

I'll assume he's going to be better than Bielema in this department because hes not Bielema.
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31to6

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2018, 01:57:30 pm »

I'm gonna take a wild stab at this and say there isn't much evidence either way on this one. With his SMU stint what games are you going to refer to where they won a nail biter big game off coaching decisions? Or vice versa lost a big game in the final moments off a coaching decision?

I'll assume he's going to be better than Bielema in this department because hes not Bielema.
So, it is really pretty difficult to understand the impact of a HC's in-game decisions except in a few very specific scenarios: clock management--esp at the end of each half; halftime adjustments; go/no-go decisions late in close games, including going for 1 or 2 and so on. Generally, in a game that is not close, it was won or lost in recruiting, scheme or development.

At SMU CCM was 1-1 in one-score games in 2016, losing to Tulsa in OT and beating Tulane. Both on the road. In 2017, he was 3-2 in one-score games, beating Tulsa and Tulane at home and Cinci in OT on the road while losing to UCF at home and Navy on the road.

So if one really wanted to answer the OP question, the right way to do it I think would be to go watch the critical game decisions on those close losses and see whether they were: bad decisions, good decisions that worked or good decisions that failed.

(A "good decision that failed" would be, for example, kicking a FG down 1 at 3rd and 12 on the 25 but missing the kick.)

Conversely, in the close wins one could look at critical decisions and see if they were bad but worked anyway. (For example, horrid clock management saved by a hail mary at the last second.)

I don't have the time or the footage, but my guess is that what we would discover is that his decisions are pretty conventional (or we would have heard the SMU fans screaming about it) and that his clock management tends to be good simply because of the focus on executing quickly while also emphasizing a strong run game. But that is just a guess.

Need a "nerd" with some time on their hands to go watch the games. :)
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Birminghog

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #23 on: May 29, 2018, 02:56:13 pm »

The title of this thread is ridiculous. I love people that are helpless but use a negative connotation to describe those that can do what they cannot.

Agreed. For me, "nerd" is a pejorative used toward those who have a given analytical ability by those who don't. I refuse to use it. In order to get over the title of the thread, may I suggest substituting the word "intelligentsia"?

I am grateful for those who have the skills to analyze the various aspect of sport and share with the rest of us. Although I am a fan, I don't have enough knowledge or insight of football to make my own analysis.

You gotta know what you don't know.

Polecat

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #24 on: May 29, 2018, 03:30:25 pm »

When something bad happens I hope he shows some emotion instead of just standing there with the blank stare we have seen the past 5 years.



Like this?

Shorttimer

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #25 on: May 29, 2018, 04:10:53 pm »

I don't really know how one would quantify "in-game management", i.e., late-game decision making. 

However, the in-game adjustment ability could be quantified.  If I were to assign to BB a list of weaknesses, I would start here.  His teams were the worst I can remember at adjusting to the other team or anticipating what adjustments the other team would make.

I hope Coach Morris's teams can at least improve relative to their opponent's performance as the game progresses.

Inhogswetrust

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #26 on: May 31, 2018, 07:53:19 am »

I can tell you this, he is going to run shotgun inside the 5 yard line.

Like when our QB lined up in the shotgun and took a keeper to win a game at old misses for a 2 point conversion and the win. Say what you want but Bret would gamble at times when one would ask “what is he doing.” It was the proverbial feast or famine. Bobby was actually more predictable in some ways. On fourth down and going for it he didn’t care what yardage was needed, he was going to pass most of the time and sometimes long passes in short yardage situations. Scored a few TD’s like that. Most coaches will tell you play calling is overrated and execution is the key.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2018, 09:56:12 am by Inhogswetrust »
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theFlyingHog

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #27 on: June 03, 2018, 10:38:55 pm »

When something bad happens I hope he shows some emotion instead of just standing there with the blank stare we have seen the past 5 years.



Like this?
That’s not a lost look, that’s a Petit Jean Meats on the Jumbotron look  ;)
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Arkansas Fan

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #28 on: June 03, 2018, 10:44:05 pm »

I can tell you this, he is going to run shotgun inside the 5 yard line.

This worries me a bit.
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Captain Morgan

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #29 on: June 03, 2018, 11:45:11 pm »

I can tell you this, he is going to run shotgun inside the 5 yard line.

Yes he will and cause Ed Oregeron to be fired on November 10, 2018

MuskogeeHogFan

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #30 on: June 04, 2018, 07:16:02 am »

Maybe this will help? Downloads of the Clemson playbook under Morris are available in this article.

The first things that should jump out to you about this playbook are:

All of the terminology is built around being run from the no-huddle, so playcalls are limited and primarily use word concepts for play names, as Clemson will often use related words such as NFL team names, cities and mascots to all refer to the same concept.

If you are familiar with Gus Malzahn’s offense it’s exceptionally similar to what Gus Malzahn has run — and not just the play concepts, but in how the offense itself is constructed, called and designed, right down to referring to receivers as numbers (“2”, “5” and “9” being the names for receivers, rather than X, Y and Z) — which should be no surprise given the long history between Morris and Malzahn.

It’s extremely simple to the point where there’s really just not that much there, as the whole philosophy is to keep it simple so it can all be run extremely fast.

More in the article:

http://smartfootball.com/grab-bag/smart-notes-clemsons-offensive-playbook-lamar-jacksons-passing-belichick-match-quarters#sthash.Y6eBaIW1.dpbs
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jhogg

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #31 on: June 04, 2018, 10:09:23 am »

I’d just like him to have some fire on the sideline. Haven’t seen that since BP edited.
I believe we will see a lot of energy from Coach Morris on the sidelines
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Dwight_K_Shrute

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #32 on: June 04, 2018, 10:14:21 am »

Quick question will we use those big picture signs to signal plays?
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NuttinItUp

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #33 on: June 04, 2018, 10:23:26 am »

Quick question will we use those big picture signs to signal plays?

Can we form a Hogville committee to come up with the images to be used on the play cards?







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NuttinItUp

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #34 on: June 06, 2018, 04:15:27 pm »

When something bad happens I hope he shows some emotion instead of just standing there with the blank stare we have seen the past 5 years.



Like this?

OLEJACKETFAN

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #35 on: June 06, 2018, 04:30:29 pm »

LOL. Don't worry CM will show plenty of emotion! That wont be an issue!!
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Dwight_K_Shrute

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #36 on: June 06, 2018, 04:32:24 pm »

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rljjr

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #37 on: June 06, 2018, 08:49:51 pm »

All I know is he can make the right call at the right time and if it isn't executed right about 50% of Hville will call Morris a moron, 40% will say it was the right call that didn't work out, and 10% will Frito Pie.
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hogfansince79

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #38 on: June 07, 2018, 04:42:25 pm »

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HogPharmer

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #39 on: June 07, 2018, 05:04:09 pm »

All I know is he can make the right call at the right time and if it isn't executed right about 50% of Hville will call Morris a moron, 40% will say it was the right call that didn't work out, and 10% will Frito Pie.


That's sad.....




After all these years, you'd think our frito pie margins would be higher

98hogs

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Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #40 on: June 07, 2018, 05:56:47 pm »

I sure hope he shows more emotion on the sidelines than BB and that dumb azz look he always had
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logic

Re: Have the nerds studied CM's in game management?
« Reply #41 on: June 07, 2018, 06:12:24 pm »

Coaching in the SEC against talented teams with crafty coaches is double tough so I'll just wait and see.
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